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Author | Topic: Pat Robertson denies Young Earth Creationism | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Faith  Suspended Member (Idle past 1475 days) Posts: 35298 From: Nevada, USA Joined: |
Except for the Catholics who are conservative who pretty much run Fox News.
I guess I can name Protestant Reformers galore who believed and taught what I'm saying and you'll still attribute it all to ME personally? Weird.He who surrenders the first page of his Bible surrenders all. --John William Burgon, Inspiration and Interpretation, Sermon II.
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Tangle Member Posts: 9516 From: UK Joined: Member Rating: 5.1
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Uh huh, dictionaries can lie I think it would save us a bit of time if you published your own dictionary. (And start your own branch of Christianity while you're at it.)Life, don't talk to me about life - Marvin the Paranoid Android
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Faith  Suspended Member (Idle past 1475 days) Posts: 35298 From: Nevada, USA Joined: |
Oh Pat Robertson unfortunately IS in line with other "evangelicals" on both Genesis and Catholicism, these are positions he really does subscribe to as do others.
Yes I've tried to do the calculations, didn't spend a lot of time at it. It's hard to keep the different dates of births and deaths lined up correctly, but I assume it's possible if you have the patience for it, which I don't, which is why I defer to Bishop Ussher. In any case it's AROUND 6000 years by ANYBODY's calculations and not anywhere near the Old Earth explanation for the dinosaurs.He who surrenders the first page of his Bible surrenders all. --John William Burgon, Inspiration and Interpretation, Sermon II.
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Rahvin Member Posts: 4046 Joined: Member Rating: 8.3
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I guess I can name Protestant Reformers galore who believed and taught what I'm saying and you'll still attribute it all to ME personally? Weird. Don't worry, Faith. We all know you're not the first or last Christian to use the "No True Scotsman" argument to distance yourself from anyone who disagrees with you. Christianity as a whole has a very long history of individual sects denying that other denomination's are "true Scotsman" er, "True Christians." We get it, we understand - only those specific Protestant denominations (and even congregations) that agree with you on Biblical interpretation including (but not limited to) the Earth being 6-9000 years old can possibly be "True Christians" under your judgment. All others are at minimum being led astray by deception, or worse, are active tools of Satan. That about cover it?The human understanding when it has once adopted an opinion (either as being the received opinion or as being agreeable to itself) draws all things else to support and agree with it. - Francis Bacon "There are two novels that can change a bookish fourteen-year old's life: The Lord of the Rings and Atlas Shrugged. One is a childish fantasy that often engenders a lifelong obsession with its unbelievable heroes, leading to an emotionally stunted, socially crippled adulthood, unable to deal with the real world. The other, of course, involves orcs." - John Rogers A world that can be explained even with bad reasons is a familiar world. But, on the other hand, in a universe suddenly divested of illusions and lights, man feels an alien, a stranger. His exile is without remedy since he is deprived of the memory of a lost home or the hope of a promised land. This divorce between man and his life, the actor and his setting, is properly the feeling of absurdity. — Albert Camus "...the pious hope that by combining numerous little turds ofvariously tainted data, one can obtain a valuable result; but in fact, the outcome is merely a larger than average pile of shit." Barash, David 1995.
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AdminModulous Administrator Posts: 897 Joined:
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Links and information for the forum. Each thread represents a topic. Add information to a topic by replying to the topic's thread. Create a new thread for new topics.
Whether or not Roman Catholicism is Christianity is a new topic that requires a new thread. This thread is for adding information to and perhaps pass the occasional comment on the Pat Robertson comments in the linked to video.
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Tanypteryx Member Posts: 4451 From: Oregon, USA Joined: Member Rating: 5.5 |
faith writes: I guess I can name Protestant Reformers galore who believed and taught what I'm saying and you'll still attribute it all to ME personally? Weird. Yes, it is weird, because the only thing I attribute to you personally, is your impeccable judgment.
faith writes: ALL offenses are wrong, in any case of course, but there is no comparison. Tens of MILLIONS of Bible believers were tortured and killed by the Inquisition. I know that number is denied, thanks to propagandists who get into Wikipedia and the like, so I'll have to find sources for it, but it's well known outside the propaganda circuits. Well, Pat Robertson has at least 700 in his propaganda circuit, so I guess that trumps your propaganda circuit of one. Keep up the good work. ABE: Sorry Mod Edited by Tanypteryx, : posted before I saw Mod's messageWhat if Eleanor Roosevelt had wings? -- Monty Python One important characteristic of a theory is that is has survived repeated attempts to falsify it. Contrary to your understanding, all available evidence confirms it. --Subbie If evolution is shown to be false, it will be at the hands of things that are true, not made up. --percy
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Tempe 12ft Chicken Member (Idle past 366 days) Posts: 438 From: Tempe, Az. Joined:
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Faith writes: Again, this is about the INSTITUTION, the Vatican, the Papacy, not Catholics themselves. And again, the Papacy, the Vatican doctrine states that Catholicism began with Peter as the first Pope following the traditions set forth by Christ...AKA=Christian. Now, you may want to claim otherwise, but the fact of the matter is that Christian is a word that means a person or group that believes in the divinity of Christ and his teachings...Catholics fall into that, so do protestants, so do Mormons...you are all Christians, unless you want to change definitions. Oh, so because something is more political (During a religion controlled politics era) than religious it gets a bypass? No, it does not.Protestants choosing to control moral behavior by punishing individuals for dancing, drinking and being entertained gets a bypass? Why? And you are correct that Calvin executed Servetus, but they were actually executing theological dissidents in Germany and I am pretty sure that means more than one. Then, we have the Huguenot soldiers, who hunted priests. According to the website I am reading (which you probably will claim is not factual because it is about atheism), "one captain is reported to have worn a necklace of priests' ears." Then we have the Church of England killing both Protestants and Catholics for dissenting views. In other words, stop acting like your group was the only one marginalized by another. Should I hold the city of Rome as responsible for what occured to the early Christians (part of Catholicism) in the Colliseum? No, because that would be pointless, stupid, and ignorant. Give up on the blame game because we all know the Catholic Churches sins, they were done right out in the open, for all the World to see. I am sure I can find many more examples of executions done by the Protestants, let me know if you would like them. Also, why would the Catholic Church, under Pope John Paul II, apologize for the Inquisitions if there were not true guilt involved. At least according to Catholic faith, it is pointless to apologize for something that you do not feel guilty for because you are not penitent. Seems like maybe you are simply building up this giant Catholic conspiracy in your own head. I would love to hear where you got this official church doctrine from, especially considering I never once heard it in twenty years in the church and as a youth leader for nine years. I can actually guarantee you that the Catholic Church is not currently following the rules of the Inquisition about putting Protestants to death, so how is it still adhered to? By telling individuals that Protestantism is wrong? So what? They are allowed their opinion of your church, just like you can believe they are wrong. How powerful is the curse of the Catholic Church against Protestants, when you do not even believe they have the right view of God? Please post a link to this official Catholic Doctrine that states that the Inquisition is currently still happening...Otherwise, retract this ridiculous statement. Reformation 101 - The Protestant Reformation in Europe
Edited by Tempe 12ft Chicken, : No reason given. Edited by AdminModulous, : text hiddenThe theory of evolution by cumulative natural selection is the only theory we know of that is in principle capable of explaining the existence of organized complexity. -Richard Dawkins Creationists make it sound as though a 'theory' is something you dreamt up after being drunk all night. -Issac Asimov If you removed all the arteries, veins, & capillaries from a person’s body, and tied them end-to-endthe person will die. -Neil Degrasse Tyson What would Buddha do? Nothing! What does the Buddhist terrorist do? Goes into the middle of the street, takes the gas, *pfft*, Self-Barbecue. The Christian and the Muslim on either side are yelling, "What the Fuck are you doing?" The Buddhist says, "Making you deal with your shit. -Robin Williams-
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Theodoric Member Posts: 9207 From: Northwest, WI, USA Joined: Member Rating: 3.4
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And people keep saying Protestants did the same to Catholics but nobody shows me where that occurred. Ignorance is not bliss. Have you ever heard of history? Or how about Google or Bing? Lots of examples in 30 Years War.The Philadelphia Riots of 1844 The history of Great Britain's subjugation of Ireland is rife with protestants vile actions against Catholics. Some would even call it genocide. The period of the 1840's is sometimes referred to as the Irish holocaust. This is just a quick 5 minute perusal through my brain. I will let you do the research. LOL. Who am I kidding. You won't acknowledge these, let alone actually read about them. ABEJust saw mods post. I will hide this if mod deems that necessary Hidden at Mods request Edited by Theodoric, : Mods post Edited by Theodoric, : No reason given.Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts "God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness.
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Faith  Suspended Member (Idle past 1475 days) Posts: 35298 From: Nevada, USA Joined: |
I think it would save us a bit of time if you published your own dictionary. (And start your own branch of Christianity while you're at it.) I'm happy to go with Websters 1828 Dictionary which is online and far more trustworthy than newer dictionaries. It doesn't make the mistake of putting Rome under "Christian."1828 HOME: Importance [ IMPORT'ANCE, n.1. Weight; consequence; a bearing on some interest; ... ] :: Search the 1828 Noah Webster's Dictionary of the English Language (FREE) :: 1828.mshaffer.com I'm a solid Bible-believing PROTESTANT. I belong to a well established branch of Christianity that goes back to the Reformation, and all the great Christian men I mentioned recently -- on the Creationism in the UK thread I think -- are a few of the men I've learned my doctrine from via books, tapes, radio, Sermon Audio online etc. So we already HAVE a well established branch of the Church, thank you very much. Some pages of links to information on forgotten history: Dr. Ian R. K. Paisley | Belfast, Northern Ireland Dr. Ian R. K. Paisley | Belfast, Northern Ireland Edited by Faith, : No reason given. Edited by AdminModulous, : text hidden, use peek to viewHe who surrenders the first page of his Bible surrenders all. --John William Burgon, Inspiration and Interpretation, Sermon II.
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Tempe 12ft Chicken Member (Idle past 366 days) Posts: 438 From: Tempe, Az. Joined:
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Faith writes: I'm happy to go with Websters 1828 Dictionary which is online and far more trustworthy than newer dictionaries. It doesn't make the mistake of putting Rome under "Christian." Curse you for making me post about this one more time!!! Lol... 1. A believer in the religion of Christ. 2. A professor of his belief in the religion of Christ. Catholicism would fall under both of these definitions, and I am pretty sure the other two in your chosen dictionary. Even though you tried to to change things by going back 184 years to get the result you wanted, you have still failed. Catholics believe in Christ and his teachings, that is all that is necesary to be Christian. Now, listen to the Mods and leave it alone, unless you would like to sstart a thread on it and I would gladly participate. Edited by AdminModulous, : off topic hiddenThe theory of evolution by cumulative natural selection is the only theory we know of that is in principle capable of explaining the existence of organized complexity. -Richard Dawkins Creationists make it sound as though a 'theory' is something you dreamt up after being drunk all night. -Issac Asimov If you removed all the arteries, veins, & capillaries from a person’s body, and tied them end-to-endthe person will die. -Neil Degrasse Tyson What would Buddha do? Nothing! What does the Buddhist terrorist do? Goes into the middle of the street, takes the gas, *pfft*, Self-Barbecue. The Christian and the Muslim on either side are yelling, "What the Fuck are you doing?" The Buddhist says, "Making you deal with your shit. -Robin Williams-
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Faith  Suspended Member (Idle past 1475 days) Posts: 35298 From: Nevada, USA Joined: |
Why would the Pope apologize? Because it's expedient for the moment. Public relations. But also note the actual terms of the "apology." Here's an article on papal apologizing: Dr. Ian R. K. Paisley | Belfast, Northern Ireland ABE: Collected another link for Theodoric, on Ireland, but saw the Mod message so I won't write another post, I'll just put the link here" Dr. Ian R. K. Paisley | Belfast, Northern Ireland Edited by Faith, : add last link Edited by AdminModulous, : hidden - to see the link click 'peek'He who surrenders the first page of his Bible surrenders all. --John William Burgon, Inspiration and Interpretation, Sermon II.
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Dirk Member (Idle past 4054 days) Posts: 84 Joined:
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Does this mean that in a few years creationists have always said that the world was old, just as they have always said that "microevolution" occurred?
Edited by Dirk, : topic
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dwise1 Member Posts: 5952 Joined: Member Rating: 5.7
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Pat Robertson said something that actually makes sense. Incredible!
If you teach your children things that are contrary to all the available evidence, then you are going to lose them. And trying to justify it as "teaching them to believe the Bible" is false, because YEC (in this specific case the 6,000-year age) is not based on the Bible, but rather on theology, on fallible human (mis)interpretation of what they think that the Bible says. Though "creation science" goes even further in that when (they would say "if") it is found that the earth is indeed old, then they demand that you abandon your faith and become an atheist. The gross error that they are committing with that is that an old earth only contradicts their theology and says nothing about the Bible itself nor about God Himself. Teach your children the truth!
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dwise1 Member Posts: 5952 Joined: Member Rating: 5.7
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Yes I've tried to do the calculations, didn't spend a lot of time at it. It's hard to keep the different dates of births and deaths lined up correctly, but I assume it's possible if you have the patience for it, which I don't, which is why I defer to Bishop Ussher.
It's really quite simple to do and to keep everything lined up correctly, at least up until the Flood. I read one creationist's calculations (more likely somebody else's that he failed to properly attribute, something he very commonly did in his newsletter) which then used other information to get him to the succession of kings, at which point he added up all their reigns up to the Babylonian Captivity, the end of which he says is set at 538 BCE, which places the starting point at about 4185 BCE. He gave the age of the earth in then-current 1996 at 6181 years, but he had inadvertently added a year by not having taken into account the lack of a Year 0. The Jewish Calendar reported 1996 as the year 5757, so this calculation yielded an age 424 years greater than the Jewish Calendar does. A rainy-day activity that doesn't really have any relevence.
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kofh2u Member (Idle past 3851 days) Posts: 1162 From: phila., PA Joined: |
No it is not Bishop Ussher, it is the Bible. We can all add up the numbers, we don't need Bishop Ussher although his calculations are probably the most trustworthy. And if you put dinosaurs back before human beings you deny the Biblical revelation that death entered the Creation because of the disobedience of Adam and Eve. Pat Robertson also thinks Roman Catholicism is Christian. So much for Pat Robertson.
But there is absolutely no way arund the fact that Genesis tels us that the 24 hour day wasn't available until God created the Solar Clock as Gen 1:14 tells us. Until God made the Sun and moon the time keepers of the Earth Time those first seven days could by any length even the duration of the six Geological Eras.
1. Formative/Cosmologic Era-Hadean Era/ = First Day 2. Hadean Era-Archaean Era/ = Second Day 3. Archaean Era-Proterozoic Era/ = Third Day 4. Proterozoic Era-Paleozoic Era/ = Fourth Day 5. Paleozoic Era-Mesozoic Era/ = Fifth Day 6. Mesozoic Era-Cenozoic Era/ = Six Day 7. Cenozoic Era-Common Era/ = Seventh Day
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