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Author Topic:   Ann Coulter (Is she hateful?)
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1445 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


(2)
Message 151 of 274 (679448)
11-13-2012 9:50 PM
Reply to: Message 147 by foreveryoung
11-13-2012 9:41 PM


I thought there was something bigger going on with you than a stint on a difficult forum. Please, if you are a Christian or want to be, go see a good pastor, not just a school counselor. Also find a doctor outside school if you really need the meds. You can get a therapist on Medicaid too. Write me at my email if you like. I'm no counselor but I'm sympathetic and think you've been given an unnecessarily hard time here.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 147 by foreveryoung, posted 11-13-2012 9:41 PM foreveryoung has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 156 by foreveryoung, posted 11-13-2012 10:28 PM Faith has replied

  
nwr
Member
Posts: 6408
From: Geneva, Illinois
Joined: 08-08-2005
Member Rating: 5.1


(1)
Message 152 of 274 (679449)
11-13-2012 9:50 PM
Reply to: Message 147 by foreveryoung
11-13-2012 9:41 PM


foreveryoung writes:
I was going to say that I have been told I have a high risk of suicide and I must agree that it has crossed my mind several times.
Please take care of yourself. Your health comes before Internet arguing. And do take those meds, as soon as you have them available.

Fundamentalism - the anti-American, anti-Christian branch of American Christianity

This message is a reply to:
 Message 147 by foreveryoung, posted 11-13-2012 9:41 PM foreveryoung has not replied

  
Coyote
Member (Idle past 2106 days)
Posts: 6117
Joined: 01-12-2008


(1)
Message 153 of 274 (679451)
11-13-2012 9:53 PM
Reply to: Message 147 by foreveryoung
11-13-2012 9:41 PM


I don't know if you'll accept advice, but I would recommend something like meditation.
And above all, try to keep a positive attitude. If you can always look on the bright side of things, I think you'll find that things always look better!
Simple, and trite, but it has been known to do wonders.
I hope you can give these two suggestions a try.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 147 by foreveryoung, posted 11-13-2012 9:41 PM foreveryoung has not replied

  
Dr Adequate
Member (Idle past 285 days)
Posts: 16113
Joined: 07-20-2006


(1)
Message 154 of 274 (679453)
11-13-2012 9:58 PM
Reply to: Message 143 by Faith
11-13-2012 6:58 PM


Re: It's not MY way, it's simple fact
I suppose this is just one of your typical rhetorical put downs that you don't expect an answer to but those are not my words that you impute to me.
You are quite right, they are foreveryoung's words and I guess my post should have been addressed to him.
Again what ARE you guys objecting to in my characterization?
Nothing. I have never said that Fordham College was not liberal. My only comment on the subject has been to say, fine, let's say that they are. Now you're confusing me with someone else.
Let's start again. You're Faith. I'm Dr A.
Is there a liberal policy at Fordham that explains why Ann Coulter was ultimately rejected? I think the evidence of this thread has added up to "Yes."
Apart from, y'know, all the facts, which show that no such thing happened.
The characterization of her as a provocateur spreading hate is pure liberalism.
I think the term "liberalism" should be reserved for positions other than mere statements of the bleedin' obvious, otherwise "pure liberalism" will have to include such things as the two times table.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 143 by Faith, posted 11-13-2012 6:58 PM Faith has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 157 by foreveryoung, posted 11-13-2012 10:34 PM Dr Adequate has replied

  
DevilsAdvocate
Member (Idle past 3102 days)
Posts: 1548
Joined: 06-05-2008


(3)
Message 155 of 274 (679454)
11-13-2012 10:02 PM
Reply to: Message 147 by foreveryoung
11-13-2012 9:41 PM


ForeverYoung,
Nothing here in this forum is worth getting too worked up over. Sometimes things are said to get points across without giving too much thought on the person on the other end. We are all guilty, myself included. However, I don't think there is a single person on this board who I have met, who would wish the other person they are arguing against any physical or mental harm.
Unfortunately discussion forums such as this, sometimes end up with people metaphorically ganging up on the person with the least popular view (in this case the merits of Ann Coulter).
I have stayed out of the fray even though I am not fond of Ann Coulter myself, because you are getting pummled is this discussion and do not want to add insult to injury. Honestly I don't think she is worth fighting for, but I respect your opinion.
I hope that you can get the help you need. Take care.
Very Respectfully,
Dave
Edited by DevilsAdvocate, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 147 by foreveryoung, posted 11-13-2012 9:41 PM foreveryoung has not replied

  
foreveryoung
Member (Idle past 583 days)
Posts: 921
Joined: 12-26-2011


(1)
Message 156 of 274 (679457)
11-13-2012 10:28 PM
Reply to: Message 151 by Faith
11-13-2012 9:50 PM


It seems that you are the only who recognized my problem has nothing to do with this forum. It is something in my personal life. It revolves around who I am as a person and the difficulties that has made in my life. This forum would still get me angry if I didn't have these problems , I just wouldn't react as severely as I do. Yes, I am pissed as hell about this problem, and no, I don't want to talk about it here. The few people I have discussed this with in real life can only seem to get a shallow understanding of it or end up being judgmental about it.
That said, the issues on here that I disagree with everybody about are deadly serious to me apart from any of my personal problems. I would still get worked up about them but would probably handle them better.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 151 by Faith, posted 11-13-2012 9:50 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 158 by Faith, posted 11-13-2012 10:37 PM foreveryoung has not replied

  
foreveryoung
Member (Idle past 583 days)
Posts: 921
Joined: 12-26-2011


(1)
Message 157 of 274 (679459)
11-13-2012 10:34 PM
Reply to: Message 154 by Dr Adequate
11-13-2012 9:58 PM


Re: It's not MY way, it's simple fact
drAdequate writes:
I think the term "liberalism" should be reserved for positions other than mere statements of the bleedin' obvious,
That's just it. A true conservatives definition of liberalism isn't restricted to policy positions; it's a state of mind; It's an attitude. The fact that "Coulter is a provocateur spreading hate" is bleedin obvious to YOU puts you in a category of people who also agree that it is obvious. This category separates you from people who don't think it's bleedin obvious. Those people are conservatives and non political people as well.
Edited by foreveryoung, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 154 by Dr Adequate, posted 11-13-2012 9:58 PM Dr Adequate has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 159 by Faith, posted 11-13-2012 11:01 PM foreveryoung has not replied
 Message 160 by Dr Adequate, posted 11-13-2012 11:41 PM foreveryoung has replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1445 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


(3)
Message 158 of 274 (679460)
11-13-2012 10:37 PM
Reply to: Message 156 by foreveryoung
11-13-2012 10:28 PM


The few people I have discussed this with in real life can only seem to get a shallow understanding of it or end up being judgmental about it.
THAT sort of frustrating response is pretty much guaranteed from any of us, I'm afraid, at least the shallow understanding part, even with the best of intentions. It might make you feel better to know some of what I've been going through along similar frustrating lines -- not being able to get across my situation to anybody no matter how hard I try -- just because our miseries fade in the light of others' miseries, but I'm not going to tell you about them. I take them to the Lord more and more now because I'm finally learning that people can't help but fail. And besides, I'm sure I'm old enough to be your grandmother, could join Buz pretty soon, and should have learned to manage such things by now. But you need a good counselor, a really really good counselor. I can only hope and pray for you to find what you need.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
Edited by Faith, : correct a bunch of incomplete thoughts and bad writing

He who surrenders the first page of his Bible surrenders all. --John William Burgon, Inspiration and Interpretation, Sermon II.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 156 by foreveryoung, posted 11-13-2012 10:28 PM foreveryoung has not replied

Replies to this message:
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Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1445 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


(1)
Message 159 of 274 (679463)
11-13-2012 11:01 PM
Reply to: Message 157 by foreveryoung
11-13-2012 10:34 PM


Re: It's not MY way, it's simple fact
Well said, Forever. Dr. A enjoys his rhetoric too much. He's not really arguing a case, he's just exercising his finely honed barbed wit on behalf of his liberalism. He likes to make it sound as if there couldn't possibly be any other view than his own. Quite amazingly it seems to succeed around here. Well, he's good at it.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 157 by foreveryoung, posted 11-13-2012 10:34 PM foreveryoung has not replied

  
Dr Adequate
Member (Idle past 285 days)
Posts: 16113
Joined: 07-20-2006


(4)
Message 160 of 274 (679468)
11-13-2012 11:41 PM
Reply to: Message 157 by foreveryoung
11-13-2012 10:34 PM


Re: It's not MY way, it's simple fact
The fact that "Coulter is a provocateur spreading hate" is bleedin obvious to YOU puts you in a category of people who also agree that it is obvious.
People who can read? People who know who Ann Coulter is?
C'mon, foreveryoung, this is not a nuanced question. Here is a woman who said that her one regret about the Oklahoma City bombing (which, if you're too young to remember it, killed 168 people, including 19 children under the age of 6, and maimed over 680) was that the terrorist didn't attack the New York Times building instead. To say that she is spreading hate is in fact to state the bleedin' obvious.
The question of whether it is right for her to make such remarks is perhaps an ideological question. Me, I'm one of those liberals, and I think that when a conservative terrorist kills that many men, women and children, then for a conservative opinion-former to point out another more attractive target to her conservative audience ... is less than ideal. A squeamish person might even call it in bad taste. Perhaps you as a conservative support her remarks. That's your right. We could debate about that. But the question of whether her remarks were an expression of hatred is hardly a question at all.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 157 by foreveryoung, posted 11-13-2012 10:34 PM foreveryoung has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 161 by foreveryoung, posted 11-14-2012 12:00 AM Dr Adequate has replied

  
foreveryoung
Member (Idle past 583 days)
Posts: 921
Joined: 12-26-2011


Message 161 of 274 (679470)
11-14-2012 12:00 AM
Reply to: Message 160 by Dr Adequate
11-13-2012 11:41 PM


Re: It's not MY way, it's simple fact
I can read and I think I know Ann Coulter better than you do. Conservatives generally know fellow conservatives better than liberals do. That said, no, it isn't bleedin obvious that she is a provocateur spreading hate.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 160 by Dr Adequate, posted 11-13-2012 11:41 PM Dr Adequate has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 162 by Dr Adequate, posted 11-14-2012 12:10 AM foreveryoung has not replied
 Message 184 by ooh-child, posted 11-14-2012 12:23 PM foreveryoung has not replied

  
Dr Adequate
Member (Idle past 285 days)
Posts: 16113
Joined: 07-20-2006


(1)
Message 162 of 274 (679471)
11-14-2012 12:10 AM
Reply to: Message 161 by foreveryoung
11-14-2012 12:00 AM


Re: It's not MY way, it's simple fact
That said, no, it isn't bleedin obvious that she is a provocateur spreading hate.
Well, let's have your version. I've told you what she said about Oklahoma City. If she wasn't spreading hate, what was she spreading? Christian love? Mild ennui? Sultry eroticism?
I'm afraid it is in fact obvious that she was spreading hate. If you are unable to grasp that then that doesn't mean it's not obvious, it means that you're unable to grasp the obvious.

This message is a reply to:
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Replies to this message:
 Message 166 by Faith, posted 11-14-2012 12:44 AM Dr Adequate has replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1445 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 163 of 274 (679476)
11-14-2012 12:31 AM
Reply to: Message 145 by crashfrog
11-13-2012 7:50 PM


Diversity stew
Don't know if I'm up to answer another long post tonight, but here goes a try.
That's all to your credit, which is why I was excited to see that you and Percy had opened the "Intro to Genetics" thread. I hope you'll continue to ask questions in that thread.
Me too. I really DO care about that subject, it's been on my mind for some time that I need to get a better grip on DNA than I seem to be able to get from forays into Wikipedialand. I had the silly idea I wouldn't get sucked into other threads if I allowed myself to participate on that one.
Well, first of all how often does anyone on the Left attack someone on the Left?
What? Like, constantly. I know you don't follow our "house organs" - the Daily Show, the New York Times - and you said you don't follow politics, but maybe you heard about Obama's performance in the first debate? I'm sure you heard conservatives and Republicans crowing about how terrible the President had been.
Yeah but that was unusual I thought. But anyway, if you mean how you talk among yourselves, that's true of conservatives too. Public statements are something else. As a conservative I see the usual media presentations as NORMALLY giving Obama a pass, presenting a liberal position across the board, but Republicans get bashed a lot. I'm sure you disagree, liberals usually don't see it that way. (As for the Obama first debate, he was apparently very lackluster, but I actually cynically thought that might have been planned, so cynical have I become. I noticed that the media seemed to be trying to give an impression of impartiality for a change lately, and I also had the cynical thought more than once that they're trying to make this election process seem fair when we know it's manipulated for Obama, playing him down and giving a pretty picture of Romney to some extent. Some Republicans were apparently misled by that into thinking Romney had a real chance, but I wasn't surprised when he lost and I'm not surprised by all the revelations of voter fraud on behalf of Obama I've been hearing about lately either. Perhaps you haven't heard about them or if you did you'd chalk it up to conservative lies. Yeah, I'm a paranoid cynical conservative these days. Yeah, I believe America no longer exists. Yeah yeah yeah. The divide between Liberals and Conservatives these days is wide and deep. We live in separate universes these days, not even parallel).
I'm going to skip over the Coulter quotes for now and get back to them later because I need to get more sense of the context. Told you, I've been politically out of touch. They don't offend me, though, on first reading. I just want to know the context to judge how true I think her view is.
Oh you poor poor people who have no sense of history and have no idea what it would mean if that happened, who have no sense of how western prosperity and freedom have depended on the legacy of the Protestant Reformation and are so gleefully scorning it and trying to kill it, and succeeding I might add.
I gotta say - what? No look, I get it that it would be terrible if the Catholic Church returned to the apex of its temporal power. No doubt it would be awful.
But, like, in what timestream is that even possible? Sure, there was a time when the Popes gave orders to armies.
Well, you aren't reading the histories I've been reading and hearing about. Whether it will happen or not I don't know although I know there is plenty of effort to make it happen that I know you don't know about. I was pretty shook up when I first encountered this information in the last few months, who'd a thunk it? You mean after all these centuries they are still nursing this hatred of the Reformation and still actively plotting against it? And succeeding beyond my wildest imagination in ways I NEVER would have suspected. Patient and dogged these plotters, plotting centuries ahead yet. And masterful at hiding their tracks.
No, of course you aren't in a position to see it, and I shouldn't be wasting time at EvC right now either, I should be continuing my research on all that stuff. At the moment my favorite source isn't available, I have that excuse.
But I've seen the Vatican's mercenaries, Faith - they're guys with polearms who dress in clown suits. There's like 20 of them. In what possible world could the Catholic Church wield any power but the power of the pulpit? And given the fact that 90-some percent of even practicing Catholic women are ignoring the Church's teaching on birth control - i.e. they're using it - the power of the pulpit doesn't seem to go very far. 50 cents and the entire Catholic Church's moral authority, these days, will only buy you a really terrible cup of coffee.
Yeah yeah yeah. Wait and see. If we live so long. And I'm thinking we might, actually.
I really think you can set your mind at ease about the danger of a resurgent Catholic Church and the safety of the Protestant Reformation. Some bells you can't un-ring.
Uh, I guess you aren't up on the defection of Protestants into the Catholic Church. Lot of "Protestants" with no sense of history and less sense of theology these days. Or aware of the disarray among the churches either, where Catholic ideas have been infiltrating and there's a growing chorus of people out there trying to keep tabs on these events but getting swamped by it all. Catholicism gets a good press these days. A hundred years ago there was still a true Protestant view of things that wouldn't have allowed that. Oh there's too much to even begin to mention and you aren't in a position to assess it or care much anyway.
But on my side of things it's hard to find others to align with at all. Too many differences among us.
I get that. Believe it or not it's something we've noticed around here - creationists can't seem to home in on a consistent, consensus version of creationism,
Oh I know you're aware of it. I've continued to follow EvC. I'm not sure how to explain it. You'd think the creationist ministries would be the inspiration for the creationists who come here, because they do all agree on most major issues, but for some reason we all come here as loners with our own favorite arguments.
But maybe what surprises me most and has all along is how few Young Earthers there are here. I'm pretty sure I'm the only one here at the moment. There may be some YEC's who come here but don't post on creationism for some reason. Iano who hasn't been around in a while, and Jaywill, come to mind. I don't know if they're YECs but they both seem to be pretty solid Bible believers. I could get a surprise there too of course.
I don't want to argue evolution on this thread.
People here roundly scorn and mock conservative positions, I mean all the time, including on the Humor thread, without seeming to recognize that they are representing the liberal position in doing so, all those positions listed on that page for instance. How come I know those are liberal positions and the liberals don't?
I dunno, how come I know that Jesuits are conservative Catholics and you don't? There's a lot of variance in individual perspective.
Fordham has a liberal page, I showed that, and their President gave what any conservative would recognize, ANY conservative, as a liberal opinion of Ann Coulter. If you still think they're conservative they've done a good job with their image-making.
And you'll not find a lot of liberals who see multiculturalism, especially at a college, as anything too "liberal", when it's really just the recognition that you can't bring a lot of people together in one place without necessarily bringing together a lot of cultures and races.
It's discouraging to keep discovering this, but apparently liberals DON'T recognize the obvious liberal flags as liberal. The very term "multiculturalism" is screamingly liberal, but apparently you don't know that. You've bought the silly excuse that "you can't bring a lot of people together ..." as you said. Multiculturalism is NOT about bringing a lot of cultures and races together. That's happened in America from the beginning. But America USED to be a Melting Pot where everybody BECAME American. Multiculturalism is the philosophy of keeping us from melting together as one society, keeping us fragmented and divided by our ethnicities. Or our race or our "gender" or our sexual identity or all the other stuff on that list at Fordham. "Diversity" is just another way of keeping us divided, it's NOT what you think it is. Keeping us all in a stew over some usually provoked violation of "social justice" and on and on. It's really a diabolical plot and it's working and oh groan, you guys haven't a clue.
Your reaction, to me, sounds a lot like those guys who used to say "homosexuality? I don't believe in that." Believe in it? What's to believe? It happens, you either recognize reality or you don't.
Huh?
Recognizing that your college has a diversity of cultures and races and we shouldn't be dicks about it? I don't see that as "liberal" so much as "not being stuck in an imaginary world where only white people attend your college." I dunno, different strokes I guess.
You don't see it as liberal because you don't know the history of these things. You've swallowed the Kool Aid as they say.

He who surrenders the first page of his Bible surrenders all. --John William Burgon, Inspiration and Interpretation, Sermon II.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 145 by crashfrog, posted 11-13-2012 7:50 PM crashfrog has not replied

  
foreveryoung
Member (Idle past 583 days)
Posts: 921
Joined: 12-26-2011


Message 164 of 274 (679478)
11-14-2012 12:32 AM


This is for jar in particular and rahvin and a few others who thought my definition of Christianity rather peculiar. The following video describes what Christianity is all about and not what the bible has to say about little details of morality and different behaviors that people seem to focus on here and imply that if you do these behaviors, you cannot be Christian:
This is just but one video in a whole set from the same people.

Replies to this message:
 Message 165 by fearandloathing, posted 11-14-2012 12:37 AM foreveryoung has replied
 Message 169 by PaulK, posted 11-14-2012 1:40 AM foreveryoung has not replied
 Message 177 by jar, posted 11-14-2012 9:26 AM foreveryoung has not replied

  
fearandloathing
Member (Idle past 4145 days)
Posts: 990
From: Burlington, NC, USA
Joined: 02-24-2011


Message 165 of 274 (679479)
11-14-2012 12:37 AM
Reply to: Message 164 by foreveryoung
11-14-2012 12:32 AM


In Your Own Words??
I do not want to watch a 30 min sermon, can you sum it up in your own words?

Anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that 'my ignorance is just as good as your knowledge.'
― Isaac Asimov
"You don't have to burn books to destroy a culture. Just get people to stop reading them" - Ray Bradbury

This message is a reply to:
 Message 164 by foreveryoung, posted 11-14-2012 12:32 AM foreveryoung has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 167 by foreveryoung, posted 11-14-2012 12:45 AM fearandloathing has replied

  
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