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Author | Topic: The C.C.O.I. (Christian Cult Of Ignorance) and Willful Ignorance | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Phat Member Posts: 18262 From: Denver,Colorado USA Joined: Member Rating: 1.1 |
jar writes: Huh? The God described in the Nicene Creed is whom? GOD, God, or god? The purpose of this question, and what I'm trying to drag out of you, is whether we can arrive at a consensus of who God is, assuming that GOD is unknowable and that god is, as pointed out by you, a chameleon of poetic license past and present. By the way, you may explain to our other participants what you mean by GOD, God, and god. I was under the impression that GOD is the actual Deity who either absolutely exists or absolutely does not. God is the human attempts to frame such a Deity and define such a Deity based on beliefs, customs, and experiences. I'm not sure what you meant by god.
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jar Member (Idle past 394 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: |
The God described in the Nicene Creed is the God described in the Nicene Creed.
Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!
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Phat Member Posts: 18262 From: Denver,Colorado USA Joined: Member Rating: 1.1 |
jar writes: I've been doing some thinking lately and conclude that Gods foreknowledge is unknown. I believe that He created us with the ability to turn right or left, however. We can never claim that He foreknew that we would end up in one spot.
You are being inconsistent again. You said God foreknows every decision that will be made. Edited by Phat, : fixed boo boo
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jar Member (Idle past 394 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: |
So God does not have foreknowledge?
Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!
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Jon Inactive Member |
A God with foreknowledge isn't hard to imagine, and it doesn't pose all too many problems.
Depending on how else we define God, the problems it does pose may be unacceptable to some. Others may not care. JonLove your enemies!
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Phat Member Posts: 18262 From: Denver,Colorado USA Joined: Member Rating: 1.1 |
jar writes: We can never know. All that we can do is live the best way that we innately know how. The journey is more important than the destination. So God does not have foreknowledge? You and I can theoretically say that IF God knows this or that, then_________ but realistically, it is an unanswerable question.
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jar Member (Idle past 394 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: |
Again, whether we can know or not is irrelevant.
The question is "Is a God that has complete foreknowledge and is the creator of all that is, seen and unseen and that send some people to hell evil?"Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!
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Phat Member Posts: 18262 From: Denver,Colorado USA Joined: Member Rating: 1.1 |
jar writes: If God Creates something and is aware of all that that critter will do in the future, then that critter has no freewill. It really is simple. If I create a machine that I know will always turn left, then even if that thing "Thinks it will decide which way to turn" it will always turn left. If you created a machine that had an awareness of right and left and chose its directions based on evaluation, even if you had a printout indicating the directions that the machine would go during its operating life, all that you would see on the printout is the result of the machines computations.
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jar Member (Idle past 394 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: |
Too funny.
Also irrelevant to the example I presented. If I know before hand exactly which turns the machine will make then it is still without freewill. The machine might think it has freewill but the print out shows it did not.Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!
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Phat Member Posts: 18262 From: Denver,Colorado USA Joined: Member Rating: 1.1 |
jar writes: Keyword: Send. The question is "Is a God that has complete foreknowledge and is the creator of all that is, seen and unseen and that send some people to hell evil?" If Hell exists and is an option of the directions that a person will go in life, does the person send themselves to Hell (or to any of the other optional destinations) or does God send them by virtue of having created the mind that is the instrument of decision?
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jar Member (Idle past 394 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: |
Read what I write.
If the God has foreknowledge then that God knows even before that critter is created that that critter will go to hell. Such a God is simply evil.Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!
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Phat Member Posts: 18262 From: Denver,Colorado USA Joined: Member Rating: 1.1 |
jar writes: Before commenting, lets think if this analogy of a human designer of a machine is analogous to God (Creator of all seen and unseen) and a human. If I know before hand exactly which turns the machine will make then it is still without freewill. The machine might think it has freewill but the print out shows it did not. As for the example of a human designing a machine, the human, by programming the machine, has given it all that it can possibly do. All that the machines computer c an do is to calculate probabilities, variables, and outcomes and arrive at an answer. There is no empathy or morality (yet) in a computer program.
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jar Member (Idle past 394 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: |
Again, that is totally irrelevant and misrepresents the question.
Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!
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Phat Member Posts: 18262 From: Denver,Colorado USA Joined: Member Rating: 1.1 |
jar writes: If the God has foreknowledge then that God knows even before that critter is created that that critter will go to hell. Keyword: foreknowledge. One definition that I found was this: quote: Computers are not human minds. What is the difference between what a computer does and what a human mind is capable of doing? One answer that jumps out at me is this: The ability to think independently of a program.
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jar Member (Idle past 394 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: |
That is still totally irrelevant. The discussion is about what God does, not what the human does.
If the God has foreknowledge then that God knows even before that critter is created that that critter will go to hell.Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!
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