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Author Topic:   Bush's Shia Islamic War Vs Obama's Sunni War
Buzsaw
Inactive Member


(1)
Message 1 of 111 (599549)
01-08-2011 7:09 PM


I've been doing some research on the religions of Muslim nations to which President Obama has been favorable with and those to which he has not.
The religious majority of the Muslim populations of the following nations are Shariah type Sunnis: Kenya, Afghanistan, Saudi Arabia, Pakistan, Syria and Indonesia.
Iraq and Iran are predominantly Shia Muslim, now that Saddam Hussein (Sunni Muslim) and his Shia regime has been defeated in Iraq by the Bush Administration. (Bush's Shea Muslim war)
Here's the deal. Obama, who's Islamic heritage is Kenyan Sunni Muslim quickly advocated the transfer of US forces from Iraq to Afghanistan (perhaps so as to undermine the Shia control and allow the Sunni minority insurgents to regain power in the nation).
Obama bowed to the Sunni monarch of Saudi Arabia on his private meeting with King Abdullah bin Abdul Aziz.
Obama, commander in chief of the US forces immediately ordered the end of night flights and shelling of the enemy unless first shot at nonsense etc,etc, undermining the efforts of the US forces in Afghanistan. He has reluctantly (under pressure) allowed less troops than requested in Afghanistan. (Obama's Sunni Islamic war)
Obama has worked to end our bomber production and civil defense.
Obama wants to establish diplomatic relations with Sunni Syria.
Islamic Shariah law mandates that our President Obama is a Sunni Muslim, having a Sunni Muslim father. To opt out requires the death penalty under Sunni Shariah law. In that the Islamic Sunni fundies are not calling for Obama's death as an apostate, could it be that they regard our president as a stealth Muslim for Allah?
Some, if not all of these Shariah Sunni nation's leaders have had private visits from President Obama which were secret meetings. The leaders of most of these nations regard Obama as a Shia Muslim.
Could it be that these nations are not chastising Obama for his professed Christianity, given Shariah law mandates children of Muslim fathers as Muslims for life, the punishment for deconversion punishable by death, because of things discussed in these secret meetings from the President?
I'm just asking. What think you, in light of the stats of most favorable Islamic regimes as per President Obama?
Were these personal visits necessary so that no evidence of what was discussed would be recorded by other means of communication?
Jeremiah Wright, Obama's pastor, mentor and friend for 20 years was formerly a Nation of islam member and friend of Nation of Islam's Louis Farakan.
If these wars amount to Bush's Shia Muslim War in Iraq vs Obama's Sunni war in Afghanistan, what ever are US forces doing, occupying and building up the armies of either of these religious theocratic despotic nations where Islam, by law is the predominating religion? Other religions need apply as infidels, at the risk of restrictions, persecution and/or death.
Edited by Buzsaw, : Accidentally posted original before spell check
Edited by Buzsaw, : complete title
Edited by Buzsaw, : No reason given.
Edited by Buzsaw, : Correct Spelling

BUZSAW B 4 U 2 C Y BUZ SAW.
The Immeasurable Present Eternally Extends the Infinite Past And Infinitely Consumes The Eternal Future.
Time Relates To What Is Temperal. What Is Eternal Is Timeless.

Replies to this message:
 Message 2 by Adminnemooseus, posted 01-08-2011 7:25 PM Buzsaw has replied
 Message 5 by frako, posted 01-08-2011 7:47 PM Buzsaw has not replied
 Message 6 by jar, posted 01-08-2011 7:50 PM Buzsaw has replied
 Message 7 by DrJones*, posted 01-08-2011 8:14 PM Buzsaw has not replied
 Message 8 by ringo, posted 01-08-2011 8:16 PM Buzsaw has not replied
 Message 12 by Coragyps, posted 01-08-2011 10:19 PM Buzsaw has replied
 Message 13 by jar, posted 01-08-2011 10:40 PM Buzsaw has not replied
 Message 14 by Dr Adequate, posted 01-08-2011 11:23 PM Buzsaw has replied
 Message 15 by subbie, posted 01-08-2011 11:55 PM Buzsaw has not replied
 Message 21 by anglagard, posted 01-09-2011 12:45 AM Buzsaw has not replied
 Message 23 by PaulK, posted 01-09-2011 4:33 AM Buzsaw has not replied
 Message 24 by jar, posted 01-09-2011 9:35 AM Buzsaw has replied
 Message 29 by Theodoric, posted 01-09-2011 1:07 PM Buzsaw has not replied
 Message 34 by jar, posted 01-09-2011 4:09 PM Buzsaw has replied

  
Buzsaw
Inactive Member


Message 3 of 111 (599554)
01-08-2011 7:31 PM
Reply to: Message 2 by Adminnemooseus
01-08-2011 7:25 PM


Re: For a topic titled "Bush"...
I accidentally submitted my original when I intended to go to preview. This got me all discombobulated. I've done some editing and fixed the title for your consideration.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 2 by Adminnemooseus, posted 01-08-2011 7:25 PM Adminnemooseus has seen this message but not replied

  
Buzsaw
Inactive Member


Message 9 of 111 (599565)
01-08-2011 8:20 PM
Reply to: Message 6 by jar
01-08-2011 7:50 PM


Re: been down this rocky road before.
Jar writes:
Do you have support for that assertion this time?
Yes.
The Obama Administration has already slashed missile defense in Eastern Europe that would neutralize Iran's growing missile threat. The Obama Administration has already slashed the Airborne Laser, which is a powerful defensive tool against potential hot spots like Iran and North Korea.
The Obama Administration's has killed a next generation bomber, the Air Force's F-22, is on the verge of ending the Marine Corps Expeditionary Fighting Vehicle, and appears ready to prematurely end production of the most advanced carrier-based fighter in the world, the Navy's F-18.
The failure to continue production of the F-18 could result in a shortage of almost 200 F-18 Super Hornet fighter jets for our premier power projection platformthe aircraft carrier. Since the strike-fighter complement aboard an aircraft carrier is roughly 50 aircraft, those cuts could shut down four of our ten aircraft-carrier battle groups.

BUZSAW B 4 U 2 C Y BUZ SAW.
The Immeasurable Present Eternally Extends the Infinite Past And Infinitely Consumes The Eternal Future.
Time Relates To What Is Temperal. What Is Eternal Is Timeless.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 6 by jar, posted 01-08-2011 7:50 PM jar has replied

Replies to this message:
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Buzsaw
Inactive Member


(1)
Message 16 of 111 (599581)
01-09-2011 12:13 AM
Reply to: Message 14 by Dr Adequate
01-08-2011 11:23 PM


Shariah Law In Afghanistan
Shariah law in Afghanistan appears to be in force while our billions are going to train and build up this totalitarian brutal regime.
Islamic terrorists behead in the name of the Koran and Islamic nations like Afghanistan and Saudi Arabia support killing apostates to Christianity
Despite the vast numbers of international military forces in Afghanistan and huge economic support from Western nations, it is still a crime to leave the religion of Islam in Afghanistan. Therefore, International Christian Concern (ICC) is trying to raise the awareness of this brutal reality and for Shoaib Assadullah he faces the threat of death or twenty years in prison within the following week.
Therefore, Afghanistan is a clear failure and Islamic clerics, political leaders, the judiciary, and ordinary Muslims, support Islamic Sharia law and killing apostates and other draconian laws. Given this, then what was all the Western aid spent on and how can you have a democratic and plural society when the rule of law is based on Islam?

BUZSAW B 4 U 2 C Y BUZ SAW.
The Immeasurable Present Eternally Extends the Infinite Past And Infinitely Consumes The Eternal Future.
Time Relates To What Is Temperal. What Is Eternal Is Timeless.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 14 by Dr Adequate, posted 01-08-2011 11:23 PM Dr Adequate has replied

Replies to this message:
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Buzsaw
Inactive Member


Message 18 of 111 (599585)
01-09-2011 12:18 AM
Reply to: Message 12 by Coragyps
01-08-2011 10:19 PM


Spelling Check Can Get You In Dodo
Coragyps, spell check changed the spelling to shea from shia. I'll go back and correct.

BUZSAW B 4 U 2 C Y BUZ SAW.
The Immeasurable Present Eternally Extends the Infinite Past And Infinitely Consumes The Eternal Future.
Time Relates To What Is Temperal. What Is Eternal Is Timeless.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 12 by Coragyps, posted 01-08-2011 10:19 PM Coragyps has not replied

  
Buzsaw
Inactive Member


Message 19 of 111 (599586)
01-09-2011 12:27 AM


Edit Problem
I'll have to fix spelling another time. The system is not letting me edit messages.

Replies to this message:
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Buzsaw
Inactive Member


(1)
Message 25 of 111 (599615)
01-09-2011 10:27 AM
Reply to: Message 24 by jar
01-09-2011 9:35 AM


Re: Buz, you are making no sense.
Jar writes:
Syria is no more a Sunni nation than the US is a Christian nation, thank God. The largest religious group is Sunni but there are also Christians, Kurds, Jews and Druse as well as other smaller religions.
85 to 90 percent of the population are Sunni Muslims. The next largest are the Shia Muslims. There is a significant Christian minority.
It was probably somewhat of an over statement on my part to call it a Sunni Muslim nation, though relative to population and policy, there is a sense in which it is, just as the majority of Americans likely consider this nation to be a Christian nation.
Jar writes:
Buzsaw writes:
Islamic Shariah law mandates that our President Obama is a Sunni Muslim, having a Sunni Muslim father. To opt out requires the death penalty under Sunni Shariah law. In that the Islamic Sunni fundies are not calling for Obama's death as an apostate, could it be that they regard our president as a stealth Muslim for Allah?
Some, if not all of these Shariah Sunni nation's leaders have had private visits from President Obama which were secret meetings. The leaders of most of these nations regard Obama as a Shia Muslim.
Too funny. So you are saying that Obama is a Shi'a Sunni apostate Muslim. Can you really not see how utterly stupid those assertions are?
What I meant to say is that these nations regard Obama as a Sunni Muslim. When the edit option is fixed in Free For All, I'll make some corrections.
Jar writes:
And again, it is pretty clear that you have not read the Qur'an any more than the Bible. The Qur'an says that apostasy will be punished by God and that only when someone leaves the religion in order to actually hurt the faith may they be killed. And that was during a time of war.
Are you aware that Muslims regard the Hadith and the Sunnahs almost as equally authoritative as Christians regard the New Testament? These books were written by Mohammed's close disciples who took over the leadership of Islam after his death.
Jar writes:
And I have asked you before, even if Obama was a Muslim, where is the problem?
The problem would be where his allegiance would be so far as policy, relative to Israel and relative to Islamic law, the Constitution, etc. Then there's the matter of deception. If he is a Muslim, most likely he would have never been elected, given the track record of Islamic leaders in the majority of Islamic nations.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 24 by jar, posted 01-09-2011 9:35 AM jar has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 26 by jar, posted 01-09-2011 10:40 AM Buzsaw has not replied
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 Message 30 by Theodoric, posted 01-09-2011 1:09 PM Buzsaw has not replied
 Message 31 by Dr Adequate, posted 01-09-2011 1:15 PM Buzsaw has not replied
 Message 32 by ringo, posted 01-09-2011 1:57 PM Buzsaw has replied
 Message 69 by onifre, posted 01-15-2011 10:57 PM Buzsaw has not replied

  
Buzsaw
Inactive Member


(1)
Message 35 of 111 (599686)
01-09-2011 7:42 PM
Reply to: Message 34 by jar
01-09-2011 4:09 PM


Re: Freedom of religion in the current Iraqi constitution.
jar writes:
BUT as usual, the reality is quite different.
Freedom of religion is covered in Articles 41, 42 and 43 of the Iraq Constitution.
The reality is that most of the predominantly Muslims nations are dangerous places for Christians.

BUZSAW B 4 U 2 C Y BUZ SAW.
The Immeasurable Present Eternally Extends the Infinite Past And Infinitely Consumes The Eternal Future.
Time Relates To What Is Temperal. What Is Eternal Is Timeless.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 34 by jar, posted 01-09-2011 4:09 PM jar has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 36 by jar, posted 01-09-2011 7:55 PM Buzsaw has not replied

  
Buzsaw
Inactive Member


Message 37 of 111 (599692)
01-09-2011 8:33 PM
Reply to: Message 32 by ringo
01-09-2011 1:57 PM


Re: Buz, you are making no sense.
ringo writes:
Roman Catholics are the dominant religious group in Canada. Most of our recent Prime Ministers have been Roman Catholic but our current Prime Minister is an evangelical Protestant. How does that effect the way Canada is "regarded" by the rest of the world? Do you think we missed getting a seat on the UN Security Council because we're not considered Catholic any more?
I don't see where that is related to the topic. What's the point?

BUZSAW B 4 U 2 C Y BUZ SAW.
The Immeasurable Present Eternally Extends the Infinite Past And Infinitely Consumes The Eternal Future.
Time Relates To What Is Temperal. What Is Eternal Is Timeless.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 32 by ringo, posted 01-09-2011 1:57 PM ringo has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 38 by ringo, posted 01-09-2011 9:05 PM Buzsaw has replied

  
Buzsaw
Inactive Member


(1)
Message 40 of 111 (599763)
01-10-2011 1:08 PM
Reply to: Message 38 by ringo
01-09-2011 9:05 PM


Re: Children & Religion
ringo writes:
The point is that you can't use a few numbers from Wikipedia or elsewhere to decide that a country is Sunni or Shi'ite. The distinction that you're trying to make is as nonsensical as the idea that Obama involuntarily inherited Islam from his father.
When you have the high stats that I cited you go figure. Are you saying that the stats are not accurate and/or have no relevance?
Whether you're aware or not, the rule of thumb, the father determines the religion of his family.

BUZSAW B 4 U 2 C Y BUZ SAW.
The Immeasurable Present Eternally Extends the Infinite Past And Infinitely Consumes The Eternal Future.
Time Relates To What Is Temperal. What Is Eternal Is Timeless.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 38 by ringo, posted 01-09-2011 9:05 PM ringo has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 41 by Tanypteryx, posted 01-10-2011 1:24 PM Buzsaw has not replied
 Message 42 by ringo, posted 01-10-2011 1:44 PM Buzsaw has replied
 Message 43 by Coragyps, posted 01-10-2011 2:11 PM Buzsaw has not replied
 Message 44 by PaulK, posted 01-10-2011 2:16 PM Buzsaw has not replied
 Message 46 by Dr Adequate, posted 01-10-2011 2:37 PM Buzsaw has not replied
 Message 47 by dwise1, posted 01-10-2011 3:33 PM Buzsaw has not replied
 Message 51 by bluescat48, posted 01-10-2011 5:56 PM Buzsaw has not replied
 Message 52 by Meddle, posted 01-10-2011 9:39 PM Buzsaw has replied

  
Buzsaw
Inactive Member


(1)
Message 53 of 111 (600030)
01-12-2011 12:00 AM
Reply to: Message 42 by ringo
01-10-2011 1:44 PM


Re: Children & Religion
ringo writes:
That's utter nonsense. You, of all people, should understand that a Christian is a Christian because of his own beliefs, not his father's beliefs. The same applies to any other belief.
My comment pertained to Islam. I should have made that clear. Though it applied to Jews and Christians in ancient Biblical times, I'm fully aware that it doesn't apply today with Christianity. It does apply to orthodox Jews, as I understand.

BUZSAW B 4 U 2 C Y BUZ SAW.
The Immeasurable Present Eternally Extends the Infinite Past And Infinitely Consumes The Eternal Future.
Time Relates To What Is Temperal. What Is Eternal Is Timeless.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 42 by ringo, posted 01-10-2011 1:44 PM ringo has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 56 by ringo, posted 01-12-2011 1:15 AM Buzsaw has not replied

  
Buzsaw
Inactive Member


(1)
Message 54 of 111 (600032)
01-12-2011 12:04 AM
Reply to: Message 52 by Meddle
01-10-2011 9:39 PM


Re: Children & Religion
Malcolm writes:
As I understand it, to become a Muslim you must make a sincere declaration of belief, called the Shahada, which is basically saying "There is no god but Allah, and Muhammad is his messenger". This is the most important of the five pillars of Islam and must be done honestly and with full understanding of its meaning.
I believe that is true if one is not already a Muslim by birth in a Muslim family.

BUZSAW B 4 U 2 C Y BUZ SAW.
The Immeasurable Present Eternally Extends the Infinite Past And Infinitely Consumes The Eternal Future.
Time Relates To What Is Temperal. What Is Eternal Is Timeless.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 52 by Meddle, posted 01-10-2011 9:39 PM Meddle has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 55 by DrJones*, posted 01-12-2011 12:29 AM Buzsaw has replied
 Message 106 by Modulous, posted 01-17-2011 7:18 PM Buzsaw has not replied

  
Buzsaw
Inactive Member


(1)
Message 57 of 111 (600167)
01-12-2011 11:37 PM
Reply to: Message 55 by DrJones*
01-12-2011 12:29 AM


Re: Barack Sr A Muslim
Dr Jones writes:
So seeing as Obama was not born in a Muslim family, he can't be a Muslim by birth.
He was a Muslim and gave our president his Muslim name.

BUZSAW B 4 U 2 C Y BUZ SAW.
The Immeasurable Present Eternally Extends the Infinite Past And Infinitely Consumes The Eternal Future.
Time Relates To What Is Temperal. What Is Eternal Is Timeless.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 55 by DrJones*, posted 01-12-2011 12:29 AM DrJones* has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 58 by DrJones*, posted 01-13-2011 12:16 AM Buzsaw has replied
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Buzsaw
Inactive Member


(2)
Message 60 of 111 (600296)
01-13-2011 7:38 PM
Reply to: Message 58 by DrJones*
01-13-2011 12:16 AM


Re: Barack Sr A Muslim
Dr Jones writes:
He was an athiest and gave him an arabic name
No. When Barak was born, his father was a Muslim. That's when he named him names implicating Islam. Later he enrolled Barak in two Indonesian schools as a Muslim, first a Catholic school and then a Muslim school.

BUZSAW B 4 U 2 C Y BUZ SAW.
The Immeasurable Present Eternally Extends the Infinite Past And Infinitely Consumes The Eternal Future.
Time Relates To What Is Temperal. What Is Eternal Is Timeless.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 58 by DrJones*, posted 01-13-2011 12:16 AM DrJones* has replied

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Buzsaw
Inactive Member


(1)
Message 73 of 111 (600698)
01-16-2011 3:57 PM
Reply to: Message 66 by Minnemooseus
01-14-2011 1:51 AM


Re: Obama's Religion
Minnemooseus writes:
Later he enrolled Barak in two Indonesian schools as a Muslim, first a Catholic school and then a Muslim school.
That claim requires evidence. I suspect that if we investigate it we'll find another Buzsaw fabrication. The EVIDENCE that we have is that Barack Obama senior was an atheist at the time,
I stand corrected. It was our president's Muslim step dad who enrolled him in the two schools as a Muslim as I understand the latest research that I've done.
It was after the divorce that his paternal father became atheistic. I'm not sure whether he publically denounced Islam, however or publically announced himself to be an atheist. One website stated that it was just assumed by most that he had become atheistic.
Minnemooseus writes:
Found via the wikipedia article - Obama Debunks Claim About Islamic School
quote:
A spokesman for Indonesia's Ministry of Religious Affairs said claims that Obama studied at an Islamic school are groundless.
"SDN Menteng 1 is a public primary school that is open to people of all faiths," said the spokesman, Sutopo, who goes by only one name. "Moreover, he studied earlier at Fransiskus Assisi, which is clearly a Catholic school."
The public school was predominantly attended by Muslims, but that would be like saying US schools are predominantly attended by Christians.
So, first a Catholic school, then a non-denominational school. I guess that makes him a watered down Catholic.
Had the second school been a Muslim school, then I guess he would have been a Catholic Muslim.
Heck, I graduated with a geology degree, but that doesn't mean I'm a geologist (although I do occasionally play one at certain internet locations).
I understand that this predominantly Muslim school required religious education. It required that students be enrolled in either Christian or Muslim classes. What is not noted in the media accounts is that Obama was enrolled in the Muslim classes, inferring that he was enrolled as a Muslim by his Muslim step dad who enrolled him. That is what makes sense. During the campaign, neither the mainstream media, he or his party wanted the sheeple to know the facts so they saw to it that only the info which would sound good to the sheeple voters would be aired.
Obama and the mainstream Democrat oriented liberal media has propagated the stealth Islamic religion of our president.
I've researched the pros and cons on this. After consideration of all that is relevant to this debate,
Daniel Pipes has summed up what appears to be the rational and most accurate conclusion.
ABE:
quote:
But on the larger issue of Obama's religious practices during his Jakarta years, it confirms the Times account. Note in particular three excerpts from Barker's article:
"Interviews with dozens of former classmates, teachers, neighbors and friends show that Obama was not a regular practicing Muslim when he was in Indonesia" — implying he was an irregularly practicing Muslim.
"Obama occasionally followed his stepfather to the mosque for Friday prayers, a few neighbors said" — confirming that he did pray in the mosque.
"Obama's 3rd-grade teacher at the Catholic school, who lived near the family [said that] 'Rarely, Barry went to the mosque with Lolo'" — confirming that Obama attended mosque services.
All this matters, for if Obama once was a Muslim, he is now what Islamic law calls a murtadd (apostate), an ex-Muslim converted to another religion who must be executed. Were he elected president of the United States, this status, clearly, would have large potential implications for his relationship with the Muslim world.
In sum: Obama was an irregularly practicing Muslim who rarely or occasionally prayed with his step-father in a mosque. This precisely substantiates my statement that he "for some years had a reasonably Muslim upbringing under the auspices of his Indonesian step-father."
Therefore, what MMfA calls the "Obama-Muslim falsehood" is in fact confirmed by both articles as truthful and accurate.
Calling this a falsehood is in itself a falsehood.
Edited by Buzsaw, : Add link exerpt

BUZSAW B 4 U 2 C Y BUZ SAW.
The Immeasurable Present Eternally Extends the Infinite Past And Infinitely Consumes The Eternal Future.
Time Relates To What Is Temperal. What Is Eternal Is Timeless.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 66 by Minnemooseus, posted 01-14-2011 1:51 AM Minnemooseus has seen this message but not replied

Replies to this message:
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