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Author Topic:   CERN - Large Hadron Collider and the Very Early Universe
onifre
Member (Idle past 2950 days)
Posts: 4854
From: Dark Side of the Moon
Joined: 02-20-2008


Message 16 of 59 (478098)
08-12-2008 12:02 AM
Reply to: Message 15 by Deftil
08-10-2008 10:21 AM


Pretty cool stuff is coming our way, im excited.
Thanks for the info, im going to keep reading up on it to beter understand it but you gave me a good point in the right direction.

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New Cat's Eye
Inactive Member


Message 17 of 59 (478130)
08-12-2008 11:03 AM



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cavediver
Member (Idle past 3643 days)
Posts: 4129
From: UK
Joined: 06-16-2005


Message 18 of 59 (478157)
08-12-2008 12:36 PM
Reply to: Message 17 by New Cat's Eye
08-12-2008 11:03 AM


LOVE... IT...

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onifre
Member (Idle past 2950 days)
Posts: 4854
From: Dark Side of the Moon
Joined: 02-20-2008


Message 19 of 59 (478164)
08-12-2008 1:35 PM
Reply to: Message 17 by New Cat's Eye
08-12-2008 11:03 AM


CS great video, but clearly nerds can't dance

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Agobot
Member (Idle past 5529 days)
Posts: 786
Joined: 12-16-2007


Message 20 of 59 (480713)
09-05-2008 5:32 PM


Update?
Any update on the events at CERN?

Replies to this message:
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onifre
Member (Idle past 2950 days)
Posts: 4854
From: Dark Side of the Moon
Joined: 02-20-2008


Message 21 of 59 (480724)
09-05-2008 7:27 PM
Reply to: Message 20 by Agobot
09-05-2008 5:32 PM


Re: Update?
Hey Abogot,
Any update on the events at CERN?
The whole thing back fired! There's a massive black hole eating away at Geneva!!! Anti matter is destroying our Universe!!!! Run to the nearest worm hole!!!!!
Just kidding all is well from what I hear.
Heres a link to an update board that keeps, well, updates LOL.
The Large Hadron Collider | CERN
Here's a great article from 4-August-08,
quote:
The outlook is sunny for CERN now that all the sectors are cold. The mood is growing feverish in anticipation of the LHC start-up!
One of the LHC cryoplants.
At the time this issue goes to press the LHC has been almost entirely cooled to 1.9K (-271C). Cooling of the 1700 main magnets commenced in January 2007, with Sector 7-8. Two months later, the temperature had dropped below 2K, making this 3.3-kilometre section the world’s largest superconducting installation cooled with superfluid helium. Cooling of the other sectors continued, with Sector 4-5 following in July 2007.
In all, more than 10'000 tonnes of liquid nitrogen were needed to cool down the eight sectors, followed by 130 tonnes of helium to fill them. "This amount of helium is approximately one percent of global annual production," says Laurent Tavian, head of the Cryogenics Group. "CERN gets its helium under two delivery contracts, most of it coming from two sources: one in Algeria and the other in Russia. For LHC filling, the rates of delivery to CERN had to be increased by a factor of five, to a peak of 40 tonnes per month!"
During cool-down, numerous operations were conducted. "For example, the final phase of cooling to 1.9K required the deployment of complex pumping systems combining several stages of cryogenic centrifugal compressors," explains Tavian. In the first few sectors these operations, of considerable technical difficulty, took more time to complete, as the responsible teams had to hone their skills. Thus, while cooling down and testing of Sectors 7-8 and 4-5 took place over periods of roughly eight months, for the last sectors both operations were completed in only three months.
Now that the entire accelerator is cold, the process of commissioning is continuing with electrical tests (see BULLETIN No. 30-31/2008) to verify the functioning of the magnets. Following these final tests, the machine will be ready for start-up. The first beam should be circulating in the accelerator in the first week of September.
The cooling process
The cooling down of the sectors takes place in three stages. In the first stage, 1250 tonnes of liquid nitrogen is used above-ground for the purpose of pre-cooling the helium, which is then piped to the sectors underground. The temperature of the helium drops to 80K, while the nitrogen evaporates into the atmosphere, creating a vapour plume. In the second stage the dipoles are cooled to 4.5K. Finally, the third stage entails the use of a pumping system to lower the pressure of the liquid helium so as to reach the requisite 1.9K (approximately -271C). At that temperature, the helium is superfluid and loses its viscosity, increasing its capacity for heat transfer and wetting of the superconductors.

"All great truths begin as blasphemies"
"I smoke pot. If this bothers anyone, I suggest you look around at the world in which we live and shut your mouth."--Bill Hicks
"I never knew there was another option other than to question everything"--Noam Chomsky

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Agobot
Member (Idle past 5529 days)
Posts: 786
Joined: 12-16-2007


Message 22 of 59 (480729)
09-05-2008 8:01 PM
Reply to: Message 21 by onifre
09-05-2008 7:27 PM


Re: Update?
Onifre writes:
The whole thing back fired! There's a massive black hole eating away at Geneva!!! Anti matter is destroying our Universe!!!! Run to the nearest worm hole!!!!!
Hey Onifre,
I am hiding under the table and shaking
Kidding aside, some of the findings might change our lives forever.
Here is a more recent update:
Page not found | The Independent
Edited by Agobot, : No reason given.

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Agobot
Member (Idle past 5529 days)
Posts: 786
Joined: 12-16-2007


Message 23 of 59 (481685)
09-12-2008 5:40 AM


Hawking bets 100 dollars against the Higgs
Hawking bets CERN mega-machine won't find 'God's Particle':
"The LHC will increase the energy at which we can study particle interactions by a factor of four. According to present thinking, this should be enough to discover the Higgs particle," Hawking told BBC radio.
"I think it will be much more exciting if we don't find the Higgs. That will show something is wrong, and we need to think again. I have a bet of 100 dollars that we won't find the Higgs," added Hawking, whose books including "A Brief History of Time" have sought to popularise study of stellar physics.
http://www.physorg.com/news140161003.html
$100 is not that much money so Hawking is probably not all that confident. But on the other hand, he put his reputation on the table. What's your take?

Replies to this message:
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Son Goku
Inactive Member


Message 24 of 59 (481695)
09-12-2008 6:58 AM
Reply to: Message 23 by Agobot
09-12-2008 5:40 AM


Re: Hawking bets 100 dollars against the Higgs
There are convincing theoretical reasons to think the Higgs particle will not be found. The Weinberg-Salam-Glashow model of the electroweak interaction gives predictions which are perfectly in agreement with experiment. However the model supposes that electroweak force is seperates in the weak and electromagentic force in a certain way so as to obtain the results which match experiment.
We know from studies of the early universe that the electroweak force did seperate, however the specific mechanism by which this occured is not known. Several mechanisms were proposed with the Higgs being the simplest. However obviously another method could be correct. For any proposed method there are arguments for or against it, the Higgs has the most arguments in its favour and it's the easiest calculationally.
Edited by Son Goku, : Small edit

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New Cat's Eye
Inactive Member


Message 25 of 59 (481729)
09-12-2008 9:37 AM


CERN LHC webcam
lhc

Replies to this message:
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AZPaul3
Member
Posts: 8513
From: Phoenix
Joined: 11-06-2006
Member Rating: 5.3


Message 26 of 59 (481771)
09-12-2008 1:45 PM
Reply to: Message 25 by New Cat's Eye
09-12-2008 9:37 AM


Re: CERN LHC webcam
Nice views. Thank you CS.

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Percy
Member
Posts: 22391
From: New Hampshire
Joined: 12-23-2000
Member Rating: 5.2


Message 27 of 59 (482039)
09-14-2008 7:08 AM
Reply to: Message 25 by New Cat's Eye
09-12-2008 9:37 AM


Re: CERN LHC webcam
So I guess we can assume Wagner and Sancho will be going back to court to try to get their lawsuit reopened, though I guess they better hurry.
--Percy

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Stile
Member
Posts: 4295
From: Ontario, Canada
Joined: 12-02-2004


Message 28 of 59 (482176)
09-15-2008 9:47 AM
Reply to: Message 23 by Agobot
09-12-2008 5:40 AM


Re: Hawking bets 100 dollars against the Higgs
I wonder if Hawking said that to kinda be taken humourously.
Hawking writes:
I think it will be much more exciting if we don't find the Higgs. That will show something is wrong, and we need to think again. I have a bet of 100 dollars that we won't find the Higgs...
Sounds like something someone would say with a big smile on their face. Sort of like he's "hedging his bets". Finding the Higgs Boson... everyone wins. Not finding it... he says is 'more exciting'. Not 'more likely', just that it would be 'more exciting'.
That's why I think he's only betting $100. I don't think it's meant to be taken as a serious bet of his reputation. More of a joking, bet-hedging hope.
But who knows... it's not like I know the guy

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RickJB
Member (Idle past 4990 days)
Posts: 917
From: London, UK
Joined: 04-14-2006


Message 29 of 59 (482184)
09-15-2008 10:35 AM
Reply to: Message 23 by Agobot
09-12-2008 5:40 AM


Re: Hawking bets 100 dollars against the Higgs
Hawking is known for placing bets with other scientists. He's not staking his reputation, he's having a flutter for fun...
Unfortunately the media seem to be spinning it into a silly Hawking vs CERN stand-off.

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cavediver
Member (Idle past 3643 days)
Posts: 4129
From: UK
Joined: 06-16-2005


Message 30 of 59 (482244)
09-15-2008 3:17 PM
Reply to: Message 28 by Stile
09-15-2008 9:47 AM


Re: Hawking bets 100 dollars against the Higgs
He's got a good point - he's hoping against the Higg's mechanism because it is the most boring outcome. But basically it's just for the humour, and the media attention of course. He can't resist a bit of that His bet with Kip Thorne that Cygnus X1 was not a black hole was pure hedge, and he eventually coughed up a subscription to Penthouse.

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