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Member (Idle past 5165 days) Posts: 116 From: Richmond, VA, USA Joined: |
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Author | Topic: Nova PBS show on Dover ID trial | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Archer Opteryx Member (Idle past 3598 days) Posts: 1811 From: East Asia Joined: |
Thanks for posting the news about this.
Didn't get the show on this side of the world. The trial itself made news in Asia, though. The general reaction to the Dover School Board's fiasco here was a laughing, head-shaking 'WTF?' before getting on with other business. A few people asked me how a country that landed on the moon could turn around and show such appalling scientific illiteracy. I had to explain that schools are run differently in the US than in Taiwan and Japan. Here a Ministry of Education at the national level is staffed with experienced teachers who set standards and evaluate schools. American public schools are locally rather than nationally governed, really. The people in charge of the teachers and principals--the school board members--are usually amateurs. Their lack of expertise does not make them shy about flexing, so once in a while you get things like Dover. I'd appreciate any word about DVDs that become available. Thanks again.
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Wounded King Member Posts: 4149 From: Cincinnati, Ohio, USA Joined: |
The whole documentary is going to be available online from tomorrow onwards at NOVA | Intelligent Design on Trial | Watch the Program | PBS .
TTFN, WK
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EighteenDelta Inactive Member |
Also remember that one rural town in PA does not represent the whole of the US. I think a lot of people don't realize how big this country is. I remember one time when my wife and I were living in NYC, we met a couple from London who had won a trip to NYC and were there for the weekend. They came with the plan to spend a day in New York, then were going to rent a car and 'check out California'. This was over a 4 day trip. We had to explain to them that its a 3-4 day drive just from New York to California.
So just because a small town in Rural PA had their heads firmly planted up their asses, doesn't mean that the universities that trained our aerospace engineers are teaching 14th century science. Its just an inappropriate generalization. I am not going to pretend that the whole event wasn't an embarassment to begin with or even that it ended very well (remember that the school board was voted out, but only by a close margin)
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Percy Member Posts: 22394 From: New Hampshire Joined: Member Rating: 5.2 |
The local reporter featured in the Nova program provided the best reason I ever heard for why there's a controversy over evolution and why it will never go away:
"If you believe in heaven and hell, and if you believe you have to be saved, nothing else could possibly matter, not the first amendment, not science, not rational debate. All that matters is that you're going to be rejoined with the people you love most on this earth." You can see how this explains the mystifying contortions, rejection of reality and immoral behavior we see so often from creationists. When eternal salvation is at stake, you can justify anything. About the immoral behavior I mentioned, I wasn't just tossing that in for good measure, I'm thinking of what happened to those whose names came to public attention on the side of evolution. A local science teacher ran for the school board. He's a regular church-goer, and with his wife teaches a summer Bible study class for kids, yet during the campaign his opponent called him an atheist. Comments from a few creationists on the program echoed comments we often hear here, such as that someone who teaches evolution during the week and goes to church on Sunday couldn't possibly be a true Christian. Those prominently on the evolution side often received threats, in the case of Kitzmiller (lead plaintiff), even a death threat. And after ruling against ID Judge Jones received sufficiently serious threats that he received round-the-clock security. Can anyone in their wildest imagination ever see an evolutionist sending death threats to the school board members who voted for ID, or to Behe, Dembski, Hovind or Ham? --Percy Edited by Percy, : Grammar. Edited by Percy, : Provide an accurate quote of the reporter.
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StrawberryPatchBug Junior Member (Idle past 5964 days) Posts: 13 Joined: |
It's just disgusting how devious and underhanded all of Buckingham and Bonsel's tactics were. In Buckingham's case the fact that he was making fun of the distruction of a students art work should have had him imediatly kicked off the school board.
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Jazzns Member (Idle past 3912 days) Posts: 2657 From: A Better America Joined: |
I have it in mp4 format.
Anyone who wants, just send me a reply and we can make arrangements for you to get it. Of course, biblical creationists are committed to belief in God's written Word, the Bible, which forbids bearing false witness; --AIG (lest they forget)
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NosyNed Member Posts: 8996 From: Canada Joined: |
I'm replying. If you come to chat I'll give you an email address.
Thanks
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Jazzns Member (Idle past 3912 days) Posts: 2657 From: A Better America Joined: |
A lot of it was just a description of the trial. If you read the trial transcripts you would have been familiar with a lot of it. There was some other interviews that were good though. They had most of the trial experts with the exception of Behe who refused to be interviewed.
Of course, biblical creationists are committed to belief in God's written Word, the Bible, which forbids bearing false witness; --AIG (lest they forget)
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Jazzns Member (Idle past 3912 days) Posts: 2657 From: A Better America Joined: |
I am unfortunatly unable to join chat with my browser. However you can email me @yahoo.com with my username the same as my avatar here.
Of course, biblical creationists are committed to belief in God's written Word, the Bible, which forbids bearing false witness; --AIG (lest they forget)
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Taz Member (Idle past 3292 days) Posts: 5069 From: Zerus Joined: |
One of my friends went to a university in Normal, IL. He told me that in that town a few years back there was an 18 year old who got on the school board. He loudly proclaimed himself as a defender of the faith and a creationist. Somehow, he got elected. That says a lot about the people of that town.
Did I mention this kid came straight out of high school? Owing to the deficiency of the English language, I have occasionally used the academic jargon generator to produce phrases that even I don't fully understand. The jargons are not meant to offend anyone or to insult anyone's intelligence!
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Taz Member (Idle past 3292 days) Posts: 5069 From: Zerus Joined: |
Percy writes:
Considering the evolution side has a hell of a lot more evil atheists than the creation side, you'd expect more death threats from the evilution side, not the other way around. Can anyone in their wildest imagination ever see an evolutionist sending death threats to the school board members who voted for ID, or to Behe, Dembski, Hovind or Ham? Owing to the deficiency of the English language, I have occasionally used the academic jargon generator to produce phrases that even I don't fully understand. The jargons are not meant to offend anyone or to insult anyone's intelligence!
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Taz Member (Idle past 3292 days) Posts: 5069 From: Zerus Joined: |
I can join chat even when I'm on my linux os. What browser do you use?
Owing to the deficiency of the English language, I have occasionally used the academic jargon generator to produce phrases that even I don't fully understand. The jargons are not meant to offend anyone or to insult anyone's intelligence!
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jar Member (Idle past 394 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: |
Percy writes: Those prominently on the evolution side often received threats, in the case of Kitzmiller (lead plaintiff), even a death threat. And after ruling against ID Judge Jones received sufficiently serious threats that he received round-the-clock security. Can anyone in their wildest imagination ever see an evolutionist sending death threats to the school board members who voted for ID, or to Behe, Dembski, Hovind or Ham? But death threats and threats of violence from Biblical Christians really is not that unusual. It has even happened here, both direct threats of violence and also literal death threats. It seems to go back to your initial paraphrase, "If you believe that being saved means you'll one day be united with God and the people you love, then the 1st amendment doesn't matter, science doesn't matter, nothing else matters." I posted a thread once on the subject, jar - On Christianity and IMHO the underlying issue is that too often they behave as though they really do believe that the End does Justify the Means, even when the end only exists in their fantasies. Aslan is not a Tame Lion
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Jazzns Member (Idle past 3912 days) Posts: 2657 From: A Better America Joined: |
browser is links
I am in a text only environment. Of course, biblical creationists are committed to belief in God's written Word, the Bible, which forbids bearing false witness; --AIG (lest they forget)
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jar Member (Idle past 394 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: |
P&P is published by "Foundation for Thought and Ethics" (although it is questionable if they can think and it seems that they have no ethics).
The first clear example of the dishonesty of the Foundation for Thought and Ethics (FTE) can be seen in the publisher of the book. There is a well known publisher of text books named Houghton Mifflin. FTE though chose a small Texas printing company named "Horticultural Printers, Inc." that prints mostly agricultural trade material. However for this book, a Trade Name of "Haughton Publishing Co." was used. Note the similarity between Houghton and Haughton. Second, as pointed out in the PBS program, the biggest change between the first and second editions was the wholesale substitution of Intelligent Designer for Creator based on the outcome of Edwards v. Aguillard. But wait! There's More.
quote: So it appears that ethics for the "Foundation for Thought and Ethics" means "doing whatever is necessary to fool gullible people into believing this is an honest effort and not just a conjob to get money."
Read more Aslan is not a Tame Lion |
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