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Author | Topic: Sky Daddy Cult | |||||||||||||||||||||||
ringo Member (Idle past 443 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Phat writes: I have never heard of God as being similar to a Father in that He expects His people to "grow up" and not have need of Him, however. You need to get up to speed. That very point has been discussed many times right here at EvC.
On the other hand, I don't see God as some stern Father that boots us out of the nest and expects us to become independent of Him, either. What a bizarre analogy. What would you think of a bird-father who didn't teach his children to be independent, who left them unable to fly south? “Faith moves mountains, but only knowledge moves them to the right place” -- Joseph Goebbels ------------- Help scientific research in your spare time. No cost. No obligation. Join the World Community Grid with Team EvC
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ringo Member (Idle past 443 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Phat writes: If you look at scriptural references to Jesus as our Shepherd, nowhere does it imply that sheep reach a certain age where they no longer need a shepherd. That's the danger of gluing yourself to one scriptural image and ignoring all the rest. It's the Father-child relationship that we were discussing. It certainly is implied that children reach a certain age where they no longer need their parents. Parents usually die before their children, making it necessary for children to become independent.
Flying South is an instinct...a built-in feature for birds. Irrelevant. We're talking about the kicking-them-out-of-the-nest stage, not the direction they fly outside the nest. A bird-father who kept his birdlings in the nest where they never learned to fly would be inconceivably irresponsible. He would be ultimately condemning his children to suffering and death. Why would God be so irresponsible? “Faith moves mountains, but only knowledge moves them to the right place” -- Joseph Goebbels ------------- Help scientific research in your spare time. No cost. No obligation. Join the World Community Grid with Team EvC
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ringo Member (Idle past 443 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Phat writes: Yes but unlike a natural Father, God never dies nor do humans ever outgrow there need for Him. You're assuming the conclusion. The question is, Do we ever outgrow the "need" for God?
I don't like the "nest" analogy... Well, you're the one who brought it up. It isn't my fault if your own analysis of your own analogy doesn't fit the point you're trying to make. I think the Sky Daddy topic is tailor-made for discussion of closer-to-earth sky-daddies.
...how about mansion? Notice your own reference:
quote: He wasn't talking about keeping us in His mansion. He was talking about our own mansions. That's a picture of an independent adult child, isn't it? And why is He preparing a place for us?
quote: So we can be with Him, not so He can wipe our noses and screen our boyfriends.
I believe that God expects us to become mature in our Faith and to use the reasoning that He gave us. Becoming mature in our faith means understanding that faith is not a substitute for reason. Nor should it be an excuse to dangle on the apron strings. “Faith moves mountains, but only knowledge moves them to the right place” -- Joseph Goebbels ------------- Help scientific research in your spare time. No cost. No obligation. Join the World Community Grid with Team EvC
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ringo Member (Idle past 443 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Your quotemines don't seem to support your point.
Read a little further in Proverbs:
quote: Happy is the man that groweth up. That's why the father correcteth him - so he will grow up and take charge of his own conscience. And:
quote: The context is a mature warrior trusting in God as an ally, not a babe in arms depending on mommy/daddy. “Faith moves mountains, but only knowledge moves them to the right place” -- Joseph Goebbels
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ringo Member (Idle past 443 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Phat writes: Don't you think that a person can both be mature and trust in the Lord on a daily prayerful communion basis? Sure, but trusting your bed-ridden earth-daddy and communing with him on a daily basis isn't what you've been advocating, is it? Why does trust and communication have to involve swinging from apron-strings? Disclaimer: The above statement is without a doubt, the most LUDICROUS, IDIOTIC AND PERFECT EXAMPLE OF WILLFUL STUPIDITY, THAT I HAVE EVER SEEN OR HEARD.
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ringo Member (Idle past 443 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Phat writes: I try and pray every day, but I dont treat God like Major Nelson treated Jeannie! Get your pop culture straight. Jeannie was not a father figure. You treat God more like Sonny Drysdale treated his father (or mother).
I believe that God gives me the wisdom I need to mature. But you keep telling us that you only want to mature so far. You don't mind maturing from Opie Taylor to Richie Cunningham, but you don't want to be the real Ron Howard and make your own movie.
My point is that God is a loving Father....not some distant omnipotant mega-bundle of energy halfway across the universe! That isn't the topic. Disclaimer: The above statement is without a doubt, the most LUDICROUS, IDIOTIC AND PERFECT EXAMPLE OF WILLFUL STUPIDITY, THAT I HAVE EVER SEEN OR HEARD.
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ringo Member (Idle past 443 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Phat writes: Again, isn't "making our own movie" the same thing as the ye shall be as gods syndrome? "Ye shall be as gods" isn't a syndrome. It's the choice that Adam and Eve made. It's why God gave them - and us - free will. It's the choice He wants us to make.
... I also don't believe that He simply expects us to do anything we imagine to do without consulting Him via some form of communion--be it prayer or meditation. So you keep saying over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over again. There's no doubt that that's what you believe, Richie. What I'm asking is, "Why is it so bad to be Ron?" Why (and how) have you picked an arbitrary spot for your development to come to a screeching halt?
All of this happened,because we imagined and followed through on our discoveries. And all because we didn't listen to the "communion" that told us to be afraid.
After all, im sure He is not proud of the H-Bomb! We have stolen fire from the gods. Disclaimer: The above statement is without a doubt, the most LUDICROUS, IDIOTIC AND PERFECT EXAMPLE OF WILLFUL STUPIDITY, THAT I HAVE EVER SEEN OR HEARD.
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ringo Member (Idle past 443 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Phat writes:
If there's no detectable difference between communing with God and communing with humans, what's the point of (pretending you're) communing with God?
You, however, may have a different form of communion---perhaps one such as Stiles that involves only humans.
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ringo Member (Idle past 443 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Phat writes:
Reference, please. For one thing, Jesus advocated it. He also advocated helping the poor (and I do have references) but you routinely toss that aside as if it was secondary.
Phat writes:
Within the context of The Lord of the Rings there are walking trees. Within that context, we need to pretend that they're real or there's no point in being within that context.
Within the context of my belief, there is no pretending.
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