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Author Topic:   Archetypes
Brad McFall
Member (Idle past 5353 days)
Posts: 3428
From: Ithaca,NY, USA
Joined: 12-20-2001


Message 5 of 9 (39002)
05-05-2003 11:21 AM
Reply to: Message 1 by dinoflagulates
05-05-2003 7:31 AM


gibbons dont have sharp elbows
Im in a debate with a creationst over vestiges. He has proposed that vestigial structures come about due to the Archetype on which it is based on. For example the archetype on which all vertebrates are based can be found here: Richard Owen (1804-1892)
To say it simple: it is a blueprint used by God to create all vertebrates with. Only with different sizes or different functions for the bones.
Allthough I understand that archetypes lack explanatory power which the ToE does provide- Why for example would an all powerfull God need to use a blueprint while he could all animals perfect- I dont think this will convince him. What Im really looking for is something (a bone or organ) that is present in some vertebrates but not in all. Or another argument that cripples the archetype argument effectively.
any suggestions?
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Actually I do indeed know aboslutely what you are talking about. This was a problem I struggled with when I was trying to compare the hemi-pene of snakes with their vertebrae and indeed you are actually correct to *wonder* if there is not some organ or bone that is present in ALL vertebrates for on finding *this* one would indeed "cripple" or say, 'advance' the archetype argument. When I noticed in those Permian herps that have "sails" and the bone Structure "above" the vertebrae is in series of lines projecting at right angles to each other it was clear to me that the molecular embryology of this either sealed the case for "homology or showed in geometric reality the falsity of some such process that today Gould calls deep homology which indeed DOES NOT need to be visualizable (neither a bone or organ need apply). Unfortunately for questions like this I do not even think of this stuff this way any more. Later.

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 Message 1 by dinoflagulates, posted 05-05-2003 7:31 AM dinoflagulates has not replied

  
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