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Author Topic:   -Moral Standard In All of Humanity-
RAZD
Member (Idle past 1435 days)
Posts: 20714
From: the other end of the sidewalk
Joined: 03-14-2004


Message 42 of 72 (378603)
01-21-2007 10:57 AM
Reply to: Message 1 by joshua221
01-20-2007 3:58 PM


absolute versus relative moral standards
There exists what is truly and absolutely right and we can discern what that is, ... We know that such a model or standard exists
You are asserting that there is a single absolute moral standard.
The evidence is that this is not so: different cultures have different standards, and different people within every culture have different standards.
Evidence: gay rights, abortion, stem cell research, euthanasia, etc. We even have some people that think medical treatment is immoral.
Conclusion: We know that such an absolute model or standard does NOT exist.
... we trust that God did not create some sort of silly and simple-minded game for humans to take part in.
Why is this nonsense?
Two reasons. One is the false absolutism asserted (and invalidated above), the other is an assumption that what you want to be (an absolute standard) would only come from your version of what god created.
Enjoy.

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we are limited in our ability to understand
by our ability to understand
RebelAAmericanOZen[Deist
... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ...
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This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by joshua221, posted 01-20-2007 3:58 PM joshua221 has not replied

  
RAZD
Member (Idle past 1435 days)
Posts: 20714
From: the other end of the sidewalk
Joined: 03-14-2004


Message 48 of 72 (378875)
01-22-2007 7:37 AM
Reply to: Message 47 by Doddy
01-22-2007 3:37 AM


Re: Morality evolved
A society where it is right to kill infants is not going to be selected for,
False.
Any group that produces more babies than it needs will have enough to pass on the genes whether it kills some or some of the surplus die from other causes (especially ones eliminated by modern medicine)
Infanticide has been practiced down through the ages, and has not stopped either the cultures of the time or the progress of human population to cover the globe.
A group that produces too many young for parents to take care of will have sickly and malnourished children. When this happens in nature parents decide which child gets fed - better to have one survive than none. This behavior has been selected for ...
Babies that have parents that want them will have better provisions for their future and will be better able to survive.
Don't misuse evolution to support your belief on what is moral -- evolution isn't moral or immoral it just picks what works.
Enjoy.

Join the effort to unravel AIDS/HIV, unfold Proteomes, fight Cancer,
compare Fiocruz Genome and fight Muscular Dystrophy with Team EvC! (click)


we are limited in our ability to understand
by our ability to understand
RebelAAmericanOZen[Deist
... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ...
to share.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 47 by Doddy, posted 01-22-2007 3:37 AM Doddy has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 49 by Doddy, posted 01-22-2007 8:07 AM RAZD has replied

  
RAZD
Member (Idle past 1435 days)
Posts: 20714
From: the other end of the sidewalk
Joined: 03-14-2004


Message 53 of 72 (379071)
01-22-2007 7:49 PM
Reply to: Message 49 by Doddy
01-22-2007 8:07 AM


Re: Morality evolved
I merely asserted that much of morality evolved and is genetic, rather than cultural.
I can agree that SOME is genetic and selected -- the fact that we are a community species shapes the way we feel about being in a community. I would expect tigers to have a rather different moral basis for behavior re killing and respecting others - if we could communicate with them.
But we also have and evolved and selected behavior component - behavior that is taught and passed on that is beneficial to the community and therefor selected as well (what Dawkin's calls "memes"). We can see examples of selected behavior in other animals, particularly in the way that they learn to obtain food from their {mothers\elders}. This is part of the problem for releasing zoo animals into the wild: they don't have the learned survival skills in spite of their genetics. Again, this selected behavior is what has worked in the past to the benefit of the species for reproduction or survival.
Religious cohesion could well be one of these factors. It would allow larger groups to interact, with all the non-religious groups being eliminated by the religious wars (leaving us now with wars between religious groups). The question is whether we can evolve a behavior mode that supersedes the religious ones.
That comes down to showing that the moralities of the various religions are different and similar. Showing that where they are similar is NOT because religion {X} or {Y} had the answer right on the multiple guess test, but that there are compelling logical reasons for those standards -- for a community species to adopt (and obviously the differences are less consequential - if not irrelevant - to the whole community of humans).
Where do genes leave of and behavior mechanisms take over is not yet well defined.
Enjoy

Join the effort to unravel AIDS/HIV, unfold Proteomes, fight Cancer,
compare Fiocruz Genome and fight Muscular Dystrophy with Team EvC! (click)


we are limited in our ability to understand
by our ability to understand
RebelAAmericanOZen[Deist
... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ...
to share.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 49 by Doddy, posted 01-22-2007 8:07 AM Doddy has not replied

  
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