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Author Topic:   Discussion on Creation article...
Jaderis
Member (Idle past 3538 days)
Posts: 622
From: NY,NY
Joined: 06-16-2006


Message 40 of 95 (332450)
07-17-2006 6:43 AM
Reply to: Message 1 by SR71
06-12-2006 11:47 AM


How did the gecko develop its outstanding ability to climb? Were the hairs on its toes useless up until the time they were just right? Why haven't a host of other lizards developed such a beneficial ability?
First of all, the gecko predecessor could have probably (and obviously) survived just fine without the ability to scale structures. There are many reptiles that do not need grasping hairs on their toes, but an ancestor of the current geckos you see developed the mutation (it needn't be in increments as creationists believe) that allowed them to climb "smooth" surfaces and that allowed their particular species to occupy previously unoccupied niches available to their ancestors and the mutation was selected for. There need not have been intermediate stages, but, if there were, the ancestors would have survived just fine in their previous niches until the hairs became "perfect." Other lizards didn't develop this "beneficial ability" because natural selection isn't"intelligent" and does not go "Hmmm this worked in this species so let me try it out in another." It happens because a certain individual has a mutation and breeds more individuals that have the mutation that ends up being something that benefits or simply changes one group from another (speciation).
How did the bombardier beetle slowly evolve such a dangerous mechanism without obliterating itself into extinction? If the chemicals were not just the right strength or right ingredients, or if the control valve did not close when the explosion took place, think of the consequences. If the mechanism didn't work until fully formed, think of the extra baggage it would have been.
I'm not terribly familiar with the bombardier beetle, but how do you know if the "valves" didn't evolve first, then allowing the toxic chemicals (which may have been present but not toxic to the beetle) to combine and form a defense mechanism? (Coleopterologists help me out here).
How did the hummingbird develop into such a high-metabolic bird? Why are there not many other birds similar to it? What fossils do we have that show its gradual development into what we know them as today?
Well, your website states (and I'm paraphrasing) that without the nightly hibernation period, the hummingbird would die. What is wrong with the idea that the ibernation developed first allowing the bird to conserve energy and thus become smller and have a higher metabolic rate? (Again...I am not a bird expert, so hopefully someone else has helped you out with some fossil evidence).
How did the giraffe slowly develop such a brain structure that would allow it to raise and lower its head without any problems? If they are the result of millions of years of evolution, wherein they grew longer and longer necks overtime in order to eat from the trees, why aren't there hundreds of other animals with such necks?
See above regarding mechanisms evolving before the changes that make them relevant and one more above regarding why more animals do not have the same adaptation..
How did male seahorses ever evolve from non-pouch to pouch? Why would they ever develop a pouch in the first place? How did the eggs survive before the male ever developed a pouch, and who convinced the male to watch over the eggs once the pouch was developed?
Similarly, how did Kangaroos develop a pouch? Why risk having a 1 oz creature crawl from the birth canal to a pouch to full develop months later. The eggs were most likely deposited somewhere (like many fish eggs are, most fish do not carry their eggs until term), but a male seahorse developed a pouch mutation and that was probably alot safer than leaving the eggs on a coral formation or some such, so those who had the pouch mutation had alot more offspring survive and, thus, the mutation survived creating the seahorse we see today.
If the platypus developed from some type of rat millions of years ago, how did its fleshy snout develop into a leather bill? How did the electric sensors evolve where none existed before? And why do they lay eggs? Why don't many other mammals lay eggs?
What do you think leather is? The snout of the platypus resembles the leather on your shoes alot less that the snout of a rat (magnified of course) or your pet dog. Slightly different, yes, but that same kind of rough fleshiness all the same. The sensors evolving where "none existed before" is not a problem for evolution. That's how things evolve. Maybe the sensors were developed before the modern version of the platypus and was a beneficial mutation, or maybe the sensors developed after, but they seem to be beneficial to the platypus, so they haven't been selected out, yet, but I am sure that the platypus could live without them. They are just an added bonus to the evolution of the creature. Besides, the platypus has biological, but distantly related, relatives (echidna) and shares a continent (Australia) not known for producing many placental mammals.
As for the laying of eggs, I think that that proposes more of a conundrum for the creationists than for the ToE because we have an explanation, but what was the "kind" that included the platypus? I'm sure it isn't the perfect creation and the beginning and the end for its kind, so what's your explanation?
Edited by Jaderis, : To insert "most" before fish. Thanks nwr!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by SR71, posted 06-12-2006 11:47 AM SR71 has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 42 by nwr, posted 07-17-2006 8:00 AM Jaderis has replied

  
Jaderis
Member (Idle past 3538 days)
Posts: 622
From: NY,NY
Joined: 06-16-2006


Message 43 of 95 (332652)
07-17-2006 6:23 PM
Reply to: Message 42 by nwr
07-17-2006 8:00 AM


Thanks, nwr, for pointing that out. I had a suspicion that there were some fish that did carry their eggs, and I intended to put "most" but I have been having some problems going back and correcting stuff before I post and probably forgot because I didn't want to deal with the hassle of moving everything around so the words following it didn't get eaten up (anyone else having a similar problem?). I'll try and fix it now.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 42 by nwr, posted 07-17-2006 8:00 AM nwr has seen this message but not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 44 by Belfry, posted 07-17-2006 6:29 PM Jaderis has replied

  
Jaderis
Member (Idle past 3538 days)
Posts: 622
From: NY,NY
Joined: 06-16-2006


Message 45 of 95 (332660)
07-17-2006 6:40 PM
Reply to: Message 44 by Belfry
07-17-2006 6:29 PM


Thanks belfry, but it seems to be fixed now. My kitty probably hit INS while walking across the keyboard (she loves to do that LOL).
I'll remember for the future, tho.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 44 by Belfry, posted 07-17-2006 6:29 PM Belfry has not replied

  
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