Simple evidence for ID

A design is intelligent if the produt's components function in complete harmony. Let us see this at two levels, macro and micro. At the macro level the total cosmic system involving the innumerable planets are funtioning without interruption or interference with others. There is also proper design at the sub- macro level that is fascinating. Consider just one item, water. It is vital for living beings, agriculture and industry. Just see how it becomes available. It is stored in the seas, the weathers convert it to clouds, the topography provides conditions for rain, the mountains deflect the clouds to where they would not otherwise go, the water deposits as snow in winter to be availsble in summer. When it rains the unused water goes back to the seas. Just see how many things are working in unison to make the water availabe where needed. At the micro level the human body is a fully integarated system with the different organs performing their functions automatically. In case of problems with any organ the others fully cooperate. The computer was designed later but the human body's CPU, the brain has been always functioning. Look at the way the sensory organs send it all the information. The brain collates that , makes a plan and gives directions for whatever action is to be taken. The system is more than a computr because of the soul and sesitivities and feelings involved.Rawel Singh

I am surprised if you see this only redefining ID. I have tried to prove that the universe indeedhas an intelligent design. Harmony between the sub sysyems is a proof of the design having been done intelligently taking into view the various possibilities of malfunctioning and taken care of. Different view points have been given on this subject includuing quantitaive basis, but fuctioning in harmony is the final proof of the design having been done intelligently. ID therefore perfectly fits the bill; as they say "the proof of the pudding is in the eating". I hope it is convincing. If not please say why.

If someone is hostile to life it proves that he does not believe in harmony, and people like him will not believe in ID. Any way what does it have to do with the subject?

I am sorry, I do not get it. What has this got to do with design of the universe? You are talking of behavior, which is governed by the company one keeps and deeds done in ths and past lives. It is not irrelevent to life, but does not apply to design. Any ideas on Intelligent Design?I can only feel sorry that you say "almost everywhere is hostile to life". It is not so. PLease do not ignore the goodness.Violence cannot be denied but it does not exceed goodness. Probably you have had some unfortunate experiences.Best wishes

It appears that you are an urbanite who would like to make use of every squqre inch of space for habitation. Just check the area of your house and the family size. You could easily have many more people to accommodate but will they be comfortable? No they will be choked. That is why the Creator has provided echological balance. It may seem that the forests and hills are a waste of space and should be occupied; that will be a prescription for disaster. Do you know that the forests and mountains are helpful in influencing the climate for the better? Where will the snow deposit in winter to be available as water in summer? Where will the timber come from? In the absence of the sun you will be lighting bulbs even during day; in fact there will be no natural light. There will be only dark nights as the moon takes light from the sun. All this requires the sun to have a high temporature; so if no habitation is possible near it just as well. Just imagine if the plenets dinot move if they did there will be only one season at a place. If the planets are to so revolve they require open free space. This answers your question whether the universe was designed for life. Obviously the whole universe is not to be packed with life but to ensure that whereever there is life it has quality. Seems resonable?!God bless This message has been edited by AdminJar, 03-11-2006 08:50 PM

How do you find my description of design abstract when I have given physical examples of harmonious existence? I also invite you to please see my post No 116 for further elaboration of the reality and importance of harmony as a contributory factor to Intelligent Design. Your disdinction between intelligent design and designer is amusing; after all only an intelligent designer can produce an intelligent design. And the design the Creator has given us is flawless; if you find any flaws why don't you modify the design? Your answer will be it is beyond human capability! That should answer all the questions.Happy living in the Universe!

Dear Admiistrator,
Could you kindly advise how the message is off topiic.Thanks

Dear Admiistrator,
Could you kindly advise how the message is off topic. I have only answered his questions giving physical examples.Thanks

Design is not a process but the culmination of the process of plannimg.During this process, the designer identifies the existing situation, carries out an appreciation of where he wants to go, what are the impediments, how they can be overcome,what are the resources required and then arrives at the de. This is what the Creator of the universe has done and produced a design which is flawless. We are dealing here with physical realities which are not abstract. You have said that I have said nothing about the designer. I have been saying all along that it is the Creator, God. This design could not have been carried out by evolution if that is what you have been expecting to hear. Coming back to the subject let us not make the design of the universe look abstract; it is a reality we see and experience every moment and we are all its beneficiaries.

Evidence can be provided in two ways. One is to take out the records and go through them to study how the process of design progressed. That obviously is not possible because the design was implemented billions of years ago. Also the design was not carried out but someone on this earth but before the universe and therefore the earth came into being. We can however depend on the cosmic vision granted to the holy masters by God and then disseminated by them. Guru Nanak the fouder of the Sikh religion describes it like this. After God decided to create the universe, He enclosed the space required for it in a shell like that of an egg. There was coplete darkness for millions of years while God carried out the design. After he carried out the design He decided it was time to launch. He had worked out the sequence in which all this was to be done and it was decided to do it in two phases. The first phase was to provide the wherewithal for the living creatures to be created. At the appointed time the egg shell broke the way it happens in the case of the bird eggs. The infrastructure first came into being followed by the living creatres. Only a core was created and millions of streams formed by the process of evolution. This in short was how the universe came into being and expanded. Details of the cosmos has been given saying that millions of planets were created and held in space without any support according to cosmic laws. There is reference also of the Hindu belief that the earth is supported by a bull similar to the Greek belief thatit is the Atlas. It was clarified that there is no physical supportbut the planets are in revolution according to laws of revolution. A sequence of creation has also been given in the Book of Genesis in the Old Testament wherein man was created the last. The Genesis was probably written 3500 years ago and Guru Granth about 400 tyears ago .The difference in details is due to the availability of scientific knowledge at these two times. Thisis the spiritual approach.The other way is to study the performance of the design. You might have heard of the term 'Reverse engineering'. This is used even in today's scientifically advanced world. This involves studying the make up of the end product and working backwards. However it is possible in the case of the universe to carry out only a coceptual design check and not the physical check because it is not humanly possible to reach all cmponents of the universe. We have a visible end product, the universe. It not only functions in a clockwork fashion but we set our clocks to it. All our requirements have been provided for; we only have to make efforts to get them. Our life has been organized in such a manner that there is time both for work and rest. As human intellect has developed man has harnessed what was availble in nature for his use.I will stop here and ask you that in case you do not agree with what I have said, please give an alternative process, if there is one, that has lead to what is. I request you not to keep raising questions but offer an alternqative if there is one. Over to you.This message has been edited by Rawel Singh, 03-12-2006 05:23 PMThis message has been edited by Rawel Singh, 03-12-2006 05:29 PM

1.This message in reply to message no 123 of nwr.2 I am surprised that design of a system working flawlessly like a clock does not impress you. The clock work fashion working of the cosmic system with annual, seasonal and daily phenomena is what I am referring to.3. Let us not reject anything because it is connected with divine or religion. Everything should be seen with an open mind.Please do not subscribe to a religion if you do not want to but at least do it after intelligent and objective examination. Quoting someone else does not help.

Kindly see the reply at 124. It is somehow showing reply to my own post

I wish you Good Luck. God bless you!