All in the Family - Guest star: Neanderthal

Ape or person?

and that there is no reason to think Neaderthal people if alive today could not mate with and live among us as just people.

It would require some sort of time machine to verify

Personally, I'd love it if it turned out that Neanderthals bred with people in the past. I see the end of Neanderthals (a HUGELY successful group living in harsh conditions) as a red flag for modern man. Our hold upon the Earth is tenuous at best - we should not forget it.

Nuggin writes: That's one of the reasons I don't like the "if they can't breed" specific definition. For example - do we know for sure that T-Rex couldn't breed with (insert other dinosaur here)?

randman writes:The problem, imo, is evo scientists have made the term "species" to at times not be very useful.

randman writes:But as people, I think we all understand the term people, and so I am using it for clarity. Neanderthals were a race or tribe of people that either died out, or intermingled with other tribes and lost their distinctiveness.

The problem, imo, is evo scientists have made the term "species" to at times not be very useful.

There was a childs skeleton found that had some features of both.

The discovery of an early Upper Paleolithic human burial at the Abrigo do Lagar Velho, Portugal, has provided evidence of early modern humans from southern Iberia. The remains, the largely complete skeleton of a 4-year-old child buried with pierced shell and red ochre, is dated to ca. 24,500 years B.P. The cranium, mandible, dentition, and postcrania present a mosaic of European early modern human and Neandertal features. The temporal bone has an intermediate-sized juxtamastoid eminence. The mandibular mentum osseum and the dental size and proportions, supported by mandibular ramal features, radial tuberosity orientation, and diaphyseal curvature, as well as the pubic proportions align the skeleton with early modern humans. Body proportions, reflected in femorotibial lengths and diaphyseal robusticity plus tibial condylar displacement, as well as mandibular symphyseal retreat and thoracohumeral muscle insertions, align the skeleton with the Neandertals. This morphological mosaic indicates admixture between regional Neandertals and early modern humans dispersing into southern Iberia. It establishes the complexities of the Late Pleistocene emergence of modern humans and refutes strict replacement models of modern human origins

The thing is - this child could have been a mule.

randman writes:There is not enough differences in Neanderthals to claim them as a different species, imo. Keep in mind that it took, once again, about 100 years to get evos to begin to back off insisting Neanderthals were a link between apes and humans.

randman writes:Look at the representations of Neanderthals. The older are the more brutish and the more recent are the ones that depict Neanderthals as essentially identical in appearance to someone you'd see walking by you on the street, as you say. There is a reason for the progressive change in depiction. There was a myth created that all the evidence points to as a myth, and gradually the evo community has come to grips with it, and began to show Neanderthals as essentially just people.

There is not enough differences in Neanderthals to claim them as a different species

Look at the representations of Neanderthals. The older are the more brutish

Um, the "evo community" are the ones responsible for this change in depiction in response to the evidence. So what is your point?

one of the common creationist complaints since the 50s is that evos misrepresent Neanderthals.