quote:
Originally posted by Primordial Egg:
Well, if thats the case, you can't really argue that the universe can't be actually infinite as we could, in principle, be living in an extended now, with the illusion (Matrix-style!) of time and history.
i think what i've argued is that the universe can't be an actual infinite based on the impossibility of traversing an infinite number of past events (which would be necessary to arrive at this present event)... iow, an actual infinite can't be added to by subsequent addition or taken from by subsequent subtraction... this is based on time itself being a part of all that came into being via creation (or bb if you prefer, for the sake of this conversation)
having said that, i never said such a thing as an actual infinite couldn't exist, only that it couldn't exist *in time*... as for the illusionary nature of time/history, that's always a possibility i guess... it goes against all our experiences (but then if it was true those senses couldn't be trusted anyway)
quote:
I'm afraid i can't really say I understood your description of heaven, the nearest thing it sounded like to me was the rush experienced by a heroin user, and you never drew any distinction between heaven and hell, and why you'd want to go to the one and not the other, if you can't experience sensation.
heaven (in my view) is proximity to God... hell is the absence of God... i think we can't understand just why we'd prefer one over the other thru words alone... for those who deny the personal relationship between man and God now, in time, it would be impossible to describe
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On a wider scale, I suppose you could say that the two places are identical on a personal sensation basis, but for the fact that God is pleased with you if you're in one, and displeased if you're in the other, which makes about as much sense as any of religion as far as I'm concerned. Its a first for me I must admit,I've never been exposed to the view that heaven and hell are, on a physical basis at least, completely identical.
PE
i'm not sure exactly what either heaven or hell will be like, sensation-wise, p.e. ... i'm fairly certain they won't be identical, but that's as far as i feel comfortable going at the moment... my view is just that, my view... i do happen to believe (unlike most christians i know) that there won't be very many in hell, and that heaven will be populated by more people than all the grains of sand on earth...