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Author Topic:   Taking a break
crashfrog
Member (Idle past 1466 days)
Posts: 19762
From: Silver Spring, MD
Joined: 03-20-2003


Message 1 of 20 (235305)
08-21-2005 7:58 PM


It seems like it's becoming the Crashfrog show around here so I'm gonna step out for a bit. Couple weeks, maybe. I'll still be lurking.
Maybe if I take a break folks can actually talk about evolution for once.

Replies to this message:
 Message 2 by robinrohan, posted 08-21-2005 10:43 PM crashfrog has not replied
 Message 4 by Theodoric, posted 08-21-2005 10:58 PM crashfrog has not replied
 Message 5 by Nighttrain, posted 08-22-2005 2:19 AM crashfrog has not replied
 Message 6 by arachnophilia, posted 08-22-2005 3:14 AM crashfrog has not replied
 Message 7 by Silent H, posted 08-22-2005 5:04 AM crashfrog has not replied

  
robinrohan
Inactive Member


Message 2 of 20 (235340)
08-21-2005 10:43 PM
Reply to: Message 1 by crashfrog
08-21-2005 7:58 PM


It seems like it's becoming the Crashfrog show around here so I'm gonna step out for a bit.
Good idea.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by crashfrog, posted 08-21-2005 7:58 PM crashfrog has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 3 by MangyTiger, posted 08-21-2005 10:51 PM robinrohan has not replied

  
MangyTiger
Member (Idle past 6353 days)
Posts: 989
From: Leicester, UK
Joined: 07-30-2004


Message 3 of 20 (235343)
08-21-2005 10:51 PM
Reply to: Message 2 by robinrohan
08-21-2005 10:43 PM


It seems like it's becoming the Crashfrog show around here
Yeah, I've noticed randman and Faith can barely get a post in edgeways

I wish I didn't know now what I didn't know then

This message is a reply to:
 Message 2 by robinrohan, posted 08-21-2005 10:43 PM robinrohan has not replied

  
Theodoric
Member
Posts: 9076
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005
Member Rating: 3.7


Message 4 of 20 (235345)
08-21-2005 10:58 PM
Reply to: Message 1 by crashfrog
08-21-2005 7:58 PM


I am new here Crash, so I dont know all of the dynamics. I have to say I like the battles you pick and tend to agree with your viewpoint on a number of things. So if you see me getting pummeled by the opposing forces, please jump in and back me if you feel you can.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by crashfrog, posted 08-21-2005 7:58 PM crashfrog has not replied

  
Nighttrain
Member (Idle past 3993 days)
Posts: 1512
From: brisbane,australia
Joined: 06-08-2004


Message 5 of 20 (235359)
08-22-2005 2:19 AM
Reply to: Message 1 by crashfrog
08-21-2005 7:58 PM


9258 posts ain`t to be sneezed at, Crash. Go re-charge those batteries.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by crashfrog, posted 08-21-2005 7:58 PM crashfrog has not replied

  
arachnophilia
Member (Idle past 1343 days)
Posts: 9069
From: god's waiting room
Joined: 05-21-2004


Message 6 of 20 (235368)
08-22-2005 3:14 AM
Reply to: Message 1 by crashfrog
08-21-2005 7:58 PM


It seems like it's becoming the Crashfrog show around here
really? i was actually wondering why i hadn't heard from you in a while.
(maybe i'm just not reading your posts. )

אָרַח

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by crashfrog, posted 08-21-2005 7:58 PM crashfrog has not replied

  
Silent H
Member (Idle past 5819 days)
Posts: 7405
From: satellite of love
Joined: 12-11-2002


Message 7 of 20 (235376)
08-22-2005 5:04 AM
Reply to: Message 1 by crashfrog
08-21-2005 7:58 PM


I know I just got done posting a reply agreeing we should have a moratorium on replies to each other, but since you are considering a break that may have much to do with what went on between us, I figured maybe this would be useful.
Obviously from the other thread, we both have supporters. I actually like your posts most of the time.
Here is my honest "constructive criticism", which you can think about during your hiatus, and then take or leave.:
1) It appears to me that over the course of time you have become more "angry", or "desparate" in your posts. And I don't mean that because of the disagreements we have been having. I actually noticed that before we started having problems.
By this criticism I mean to say that you are quicker to jump to a position and act as if you have been put upon to have read the post you disagree with... and that's near the start of the conversation.
It could very well be the amount of posting you do, or (this happens for me) the waiting around for something to reply to, which gets you in a pent up mood. Kind of like a caged and pacing frog... I mean tiger. This break may help calm your nerves, but it could return, and so something you might want to watch in yourself.
2) You seem concerned to be seen as right. I know you say that about me, but this is not just a slap back. There were an odd number of occassions where you hailed your own brilliance rather specifically. Knowing that you were right on some of these issues, I was still taken back with the declarations. I suppose this is part of the "desparate" thing I was discussing above as well.
You are obviously smart, and you have made really good predictions and arguments. But generalized hyping of yourself, just doesn't seem to be healthy, and perhaps sets yourself up to be more defensive when someone comes in with good arguments against your position.
In other words you have already proven yourself as intelligent and enjoyable, so you don't have to concentrate on how right you are but instead should begin seeking out where you are wrong. Welcome opposition as a challenge to yourself, because you can afford to accept error in order to grow further.
If you feel you are so brilliant there is no room to grow, then there are other problems.
3) This next point comes right from the previous one. And this is going to be very practical. You need more practice in analyzing long arguments and logic. And by this I mean gaining patience with long and perhaps longwinded writings.
If this is all about fun for you, and that certainly isn't fun, then don't do it. However I thought I remember you saying you wanted to get into science, perhaps as a writer of some kind. In that case you need to build up your mental callouses.
You have without question missed some of what I said, and what I was doing, due to an impatience with (and perhaps lack of experience in) analyzing and writing long scientific or legal literature.
This experience can only help you gain in the long term, unless of course it makes you longwinded or complex like me and arach and bill, and so alienate some readers.
Summary: Okay so I got longwinded again. But I wanted to be helpful. At the very least you can see what my evaluation of your style is. Despite our disagreements, I feel you are useful and many times right. As others have said, I tend to read your posts among the first. Obviously I do think you are wrong on some issues, but that is not as important as the "problems" I see cropping up in your writing. You could lose some of the anger, and focus less on how right you have been (you've earned your wings already), to focus on your own deficiencies which requires more patient and practiced analysis of positions and evidence before replying.
The tiger...uh frog... needs to stop pacing, ready to leap as the door is opened, and instead lie back and watch what people are really doing outside that cage, get to know them deeper than what you need for immediate attack, and letting them come in where you can maul them even better.
Sacrifice speed and number of responses, to gain in overt quality of responses, and more importantly the ability to analyze onesself and others to a greater depth.

holmes
"...what a fool believes he sees, no wise man has the power to reason away.."(D. Bros)

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by crashfrog, posted 08-21-2005 7:58 PM crashfrog has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 8 by robinrohan, posted 08-22-2005 8:32 AM Silent H has replied

  
robinrohan
Inactive Member


Message 8 of 20 (235406)
08-22-2005 8:32 AM
Reply to: Message 7 by Silent H
08-22-2005 5:04 AM


2) You seem concerned to be seen as right. I know you say that about me, but this is not just a slap back.
To be perfectly frank, Holmes, I think that is true of you and Crshfrog--and a lot of other people.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 7 by Silent H, posted 08-22-2005 5:04 AM Silent H has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 9 by Silent H, posted 08-22-2005 9:29 AM robinrohan has replied

  
Silent H
Member (Idle past 5819 days)
Posts: 7405
From: satellite of love
Joined: 12-11-2002


Message 9 of 20 (235419)
08-22-2005 9:29 AM
Reply to: Message 8 by robinrohan
08-22-2005 8:32 AM


To be perfectly frank, Holmes, I think that is true of you and Crshfrog--and a lot of other people.
To be absolutely clear, I think almost 100% of posters here, including myself and you, are concerned with being seen as right. I tried to explain the difference I saw in Crash.
While some may gloat from time to time (and that is true with me as well) about a past victory, or a history of victories with a specific person or on a topic. Crash's statements were general in nature, and pointing at only himself as a genius of some kind. Even as a jest, it sort of jumps out as a potential issue. And as I said he could take it or leave it, just to perhaps think about it.
If you ever see me say more than once in the space of six months that I am brilliant, and have some extraordinary insight into things, you call me on that.
My usual feeling is not that I am brilliant, but rather surprise that not as many people seem to be as up on things as they could be, and in some cases should be. My level of knowledge is not remarkable and can be achieved by at least the majority with an effort made toward understanding an issue (gathering info in a skeptical manner) before coming to a conclusion.

holmes
"...what a fool believes he sees, no wise man has the power to reason away.."(D. Bros)

This message is a reply to:
 Message 8 by robinrohan, posted 08-22-2005 8:32 AM robinrohan has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 10 by robinrohan, posted 08-22-2005 10:19 AM Silent H has replied

  
robinrohan
Inactive Member


Message 10 of 20 (235450)
08-22-2005 10:19 AM
Reply to: Message 9 by Silent H
08-22-2005 9:29 AM


Crash's statements were general in nature, and pointing at only himself as a genius of some kind.
I have not noticed that myself. He is acerbic, which amuses me no end, but this quality may not amuse others.
If you ever see me say more than once in the space of six months that I am brilliant, and have some extraordinary insight into things, you call me on that.
I'll put a note in my file.
But here's something odd. Crashfrog sets up this forum topic, telling everybody that he is taking a break so that people won't talk about him so much. And yet this forum topic, which, being a topic, invites comments, is all about him. So maybe you've got something there.
And you set up a forum topic that was all about you. But at least you didn't say that the forum was becoming the "Holmes show." Your point was that perhaps your contributions were not helpful to others because they were too verbose or too academic. But really, what did you expect people to say to that? "Yes, your comments are garbage--get out of here"? Nobody said that, of course, because it's not true and you know it's not true as you have just proven with your comments about yourself:
My usual feeling is not that I am brilliant, but rather surprise that not as many people seem to be as up on things as they could be, and in some cases should be. My level of knowledge is not remarkable and can be achieved by at least the majority with an effort made toward understanding an issue (gathering info in a skeptical manner) before coming to a conclusion
Translation: you are a very good reasoner. And indeed you are.
Maybe I will set up a forum topic about ME: "I'm feeling rather low. I am going to take a break. People aren't talking about me enough. Feel free to post your comments here about ME. I'll check back in a few weeks."

This message is a reply to:
 Message 9 by Silent H, posted 08-22-2005 9:29 AM Silent H has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 11 by Silent H, posted 08-22-2005 10:28 AM robinrohan has replied
 Message 17 by Phat, posted 08-23-2005 7:04 PM robinrohan has replied

  
Silent H
Member (Idle past 5819 days)
Posts: 7405
From: satellite of love
Joined: 12-11-2002


Message 11 of 20 (235455)
08-22-2005 10:28 AM
Reply to: Message 10 by robinrohan
08-22-2005 10:19 AM


But really, what did you expect people to say to that? "Yes, your comments are garbage--get out of here"?
I wasn't interested in "get out of here" kind of comments. But yes I actually did expect that if I was having issues, people would tell me straight to my... avatar.
For example, if Brad set up a thread on himself to ask for criticism regarding his posts, as much as I like him and would want him to stay, I'd feel good about handing him my constructive criticism.
The fact that I might end posting based on criticism, was not an emotional thing, but exactly what I said. I'm here for some specific reasons, I have recently become concerned about time, and if I am having basic writing issues (or it seems that way to most people) then I could spend my time doing something else as my specific reasons for posting here would be moot.
Maybe I will set up a forum topic about ME: "I'm feeling rather low. I am going to take a break. People aren't talking about me enough. Feel free to post your comments here about ME. I'll check back in a few weeks."
Didn't you have enough of that with the EvC play thread?
By the way that was just a joke and not sarcasm. I refuse to use smileys.

holmes
"...what a fool believes he sees, no wise man has the power to reason away.."(D. Bros)

This message is a reply to:
 Message 10 by robinrohan, posted 08-22-2005 10:19 AM robinrohan has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 12 by Parasomnium, posted 08-22-2005 10:34 AM Silent H has not replied
 Message 15 by robinrohan, posted 08-22-2005 11:59 AM Silent H has not replied

  
Parasomnium
Member
Posts: 2224
Joined: 07-15-2003


Message 12 of 20 (235459)
08-22-2005 10:34 AM
Reply to: Message 11 by Silent H
08-22-2005 10:28 AM


Smileys...
holmes writes:
I refuse to use smileys.
Same here. If words don't say what you mean, use other words.
Sorry for the intrusion.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 11 by Silent H, posted 08-22-2005 10:28 AM Silent H has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 13 by robinrohan, posted 08-22-2005 11:47 AM Parasomnium has replied
 Message 14 by Primordial Egg, posted 08-22-2005 11:56 AM Parasomnium has not replied

  
robinrohan
Inactive Member


Message 13 of 20 (235483)
08-22-2005 11:47 AM
Reply to: Message 12 by Parasomnium
08-22-2005 10:34 AM


Re: Smileys...
Same here. If words don't say what you mean, use other words.
You've used them before.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 12 by Parasomnium, posted 08-22-2005 10:34 AM Parasomnium has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 19 by Parasomnium, posted 08-24-2005 4:12 AM robinrohan has not replied

  
Primordial Egg
Inactive Member


Message 14 of 20 (235491)
08-22-2005 11:56 AM
Reply to: Message 12 by Parasomnium
08-22-2005 10:34 AM


Re: Smileys...

This message is a reply to:
 Message 12 by Parasomnium, posted 08-22-2005 10:34 AM Parasomnium has not replied

  
robinrohan
Inactive Member


Message 15 of 20 (235492)
08-22-2005 11:59 AM
Reply to: Message 11 by Silent H
08-22-2005 10:28 AM


For example, if Brad set up a thread on himself to ask for criticism regarding his posts, as much as I like him and would want him to stay, I'd feel good about handing him my constructive criticism.
Brad is a special case.
Didn't you have enough of that with the EvC play thread?
Got me on that one.
No smileys for me either.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 11 by Silent H, posted 08-22-2005 10:28 AM Silent H has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 16 by Nighttrain, posted 08-22-2005 8:57 PM robinrohan has not replied

  
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