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Author Topic:   Wyatt's Ark of the Covenent
ramoss
Member (Idle past 612 days)
Posts: 3228
Joined: 08-11-2004


Message 301 of 307 (207125)
05-11-2005 1:50 PM
Reply to: Message 300 by JimSDA
05-11-2005 1:38 PM


Re: How dangerous is the AofC?....
Conspiracty theories, huh? I don't take these wild and bizarre conspiracy theories seriously at all, particularly when it is combined with a strong lack of understanding of the Jewish religon, and a big deal of bigotry against the Muslims and the Jews at the same time.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 300 by JimSDA, posted 05-11-2005 1:38 PM JimSDA has not replied

Brian
Member (Idle past 4960 days)
Posts: 4659
From: Scotland
Joined: 10-22-2002


Message 302 of 307 (207126)
05-11-2005 1:53 PM
Reply to: Message 299 by Thor
05-10-2005 9:40 PM


Re: Yes Boss
Some of this stuff made about as much sense as the "5 minute argument" sketch
No it didn't!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 299 by Thor, posted 05-10-2005 9:40 PM Thor has not replied

Yaro
Member (Idle past 6496 days)
Posts: 1797
Joined: 07-12-2003


Message 303 of 307 (207127)
05-11-2005 1:54 PM
Reply to: Message 300 by JimSDA
05-11-2005 1:38 PM


Re: How dangerous is the AofC?....
the president of the USSR (don't kid yourself, atheism IS a religion!)
What's the USSR? Your a bit behind the times. Oh, and many of the USSRs major leaders were christians including stalin. Not that it matters as it is beside the point.
a Jewish rabbi who hates Jesus
What's the deal with Jews? Do you really think they hate Jesus? They don't even belive in him! How can you hate something you don't belive in? Do you hate santa caluse?
Also, the AoTC is as much a jewish artifact as an arab artifact. Remember, they have the same religious history. Furthermore, are you seriously suggestion because the ark has the "alleged" blood of Jesus on it that it serves as a ward against the jews?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 300 by JimSDA, posted 05-11-2005 1:38 PM JimSDA has not replied

Lysimachus
Member (Idle past 5191 days)
Posts: 380
Joined: 05-30-2004


Message 304 of 307 (207132)
05-11-2005 2:03 PM


PecosGeorge,
quote:
I suppose the utter contradiction in these two paragraphs escapes you?
This is stuff as I have never seen before and I have seen some stuff.
'Sanctified and cleansed from all sin'.....and 'Ron Wyatt was not perfect'.
Too bad god didn't tell him before he brought those men. So impossibly remiss and derelict in duty, didn't god know Ron would do such foolishness?
Made wrong decisions, did what he knew to be right???????
Small wonder non-believers are laughing their duchus off.
Built-in obsolescence and the ark go hand in hand. Its purpose was complete at calvary. It has no other function than what it did B.C.
(I need a drink. Ugh! I don't drink).
There's no contradiction there. You're only reading a contradiction there because you do not discern spiritual things. Spiritual things are only spiritually discerned. You must be spiritual to understand these things, otherwise you will see everything as a contradiction.
A man does not have to be perfect in order to be sanctified and cleansed from all sin. It's the "all sin" that you're stuck on, instead of properly interpreting it to mean "all known sin". Perfection of character = all known sin expelled from the life. God sees the sinner's heart.
quote:
Too bad god didn't tell him before he brought those men. So impossibly remiss and derelict in duty, didn't god know Ron would do such foolishness?
Your reasoning is very warped. You say this because you do not understand God, and you feel that God should do things according to the way you understand reason. I'm sorry to say, but God has reasons for the way he does things, and that's where trust comes in. God's purpose is to always help a soul learn from past mistakes. God was merciful in not letting the Ark of the Covenant be revealed with those men in there. That in itself was God's way of "preventing the inevitable from happening with those men there".
And yes, God did know Ron would do what you term as "foolishness", that is why things happened the way they did. God did things just the way He thought best, and it isn't for our finite minds to try and question God's decisions. He knows best. That's all there is to it.
Dead Parrot,
quote:
Lysimachus,
If God doesn't want the Ark revealed yet, aren't you doing Him something of a disservice by writing about it? He's gonna be pissed when it comes to the end of the world, yells "Gotcha!" and whips out the Ark, only to find everybody wearing Ark T-shirts and discussing cherubim alignment.
OK, I'm being slightly facetious, but how can you expect to convince people when it's not meant to happen? And why would you want to?
No, because for some reason God has let only so much information be revealed to the world to test them, I believe. I'm writing about no more information than has already been released. It is everyone's choice whether they believe the Ark of the Covenant is down there or not, but what hurts most is when people mock Ron Wyatt for not disclosing more information. Ron disclosed as much information as he possibly could. Ron Wyatt was the man for the hour to help locate the general location for the Ark's resting place. He established that it is in that cave, and now we know just what cave to dig in. There are two entrances, the Garden Tomb entrance (the one where Ron dug to get to it (and only one man can fit through the crawling spaces), which only one man can fit through that crawling space. The ARk of the Covenant could NEVER come through or be revealed to the world through that small crawling space. But Ron calculated that the Ark of the Covenant can be reached (after he saw it) through the Zedekiah's Cave, of which there is a labrinth of tunnels leading from. Ron Wyatt released as much information as he could and was allowed (Antiquities Authorities told him to remain silent, as it would bring about a holy war and much violence). The Garden Tomb entrance has been sealed off by Israeli Antiquities Authorities.
Ron Wyatt informed us that he believed God wanted it to be revealed through Zedekiah's Cave, the original tunnel Jeremiah entered to hide it. But locating just where the original tunnel branches off from Zedekiah's Cave to the chamber is a little bit tricky, and work is well under way. The rate at which the dig is going is in accordance to God's timing. If it were a sin to try and locate the Ark's location, then the prophecy could never fulfill through human instrumentality--the way God works.
For now, we as human beings are to fulfill our duty. To dig. God's will still takes the primary sway, and the digging rate will go in accordance to His will.
This message has been edited by Lysimachus, 05-11-2005 02:12 PM

Replies to this message:
 Message 305 by PecosGeorge, posted 05-11-2005 4:24 PM Lysimachus has not replied

PecosGeorge
Member (Idle past 6873 days)
Posts: 863
From: Texas
Joined: 04-09-2004


Message 305 of 307 (207177)
05-11-2005 4:24 PM
Reply to: Message 304 by Lysimachus
05-11-2005 2:03 PM


Come let us reason together......means God and I understand what that means and that we can achieve reason together.
It means I am encouraged to question and question him...any and all his decisions, his ways, and upon due course, come to conclusions. One thing I have noticed during all and any discourse, he is an open book, and based on that book, your angle is foolishness.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 304 by Lysimachus, posted 05-11-2005 2:03 PM Lysimachus has not replied

wmscott
Member (Idle past 6248 days)
Posts: 580
From: Sussex, WI USA
Joined: 12-19-2001


Message 306 of 307 (207208)
05-11-2005 5:24 PM
Reply to: Message 274 by Lysimachus
05-09-2005 11:28 PM


Ron Wyatt and Ellen Harmon/White made up what they claimed to have seen.
Dear Lysimachus;
I have reviewed the material you e-mailed me on the Cherubs posistion on the Ark, I am still trying to open the other attachments, so I will just deal with what I could read.
The arguement that the cherubs were really on the ends of the Ark was basied on
the marginal reading for Exodus 37:8 uses "out of", and reads as follows "One cherub OUT OF THE END on this side, and another cherub OUT OF THE END on that side: out of the mercy seat made he the cherubims on the two ends thereof." Thus the Bible depicts the chrubims as coming out from the ends of the mercy seat.
They failed to mention which Bible version they are using, and the margin isn't part of the inspired text, so their argument has no backing.
This is probably were the whole misconception originated, some one read Exodus 37:8 in the old KJV which reads "One cherub on the on this side; and another cherub on the other end on that side; out of the mercy seat made he the cherubims on the two ends thereof.." The KJV is of course talking about the cherubs being on oppeset ends of the top surface of the cover, and some one got the mistaken idea that it was saying that they were literially on the ends of the cover rather than just being on the ends of the top of the cover. I can see how some one could read it that way, but it is a misinterptation as shown by checking the rendering in other versions and simply checking the meaning of the Hebrew words used.
The other word translated "ON" in Exodus 25:19 is "AL", which generally means "connected to". However, like the english word "on", its meaning varies according to context, and is not used with the precision that the book "Holy Relics" suggests. As in English, the word ON cannot always mean "on top of", for example, we speak of wheels ON a car, we speak of putting ON our shoes, yet we have no trouble understanding that these descriptions do not mean "on top of". Likewise in the Hebrew. To illustrate this, consider other Biblical examples of the use of the word "AL", where it cannot be taken to mean "on top of"
Strong explains that even in the 'on' sense of the word, it is still in the veritcal sense, and the whole agruement used is one of trying to avoid the way the word is used. To use their own example, the Hebrew word is much like the English word 'on'. When some tells you that there are two angel figures on their coffee table top, one on each end facing each other, how do you picture them? There is certainly no scriptual support for placing the Ark's cherubs on the sides of the Ark, the wording is quite clear that they were on top of the cover of the Ark. Even if Hebrew word isn't clear enough for some, the Greek wording used in Hebrews 9:4-5 "the ark of the covenant overlaid all around with gold, in which were the golden jar having the manna and the rod of Aaron that budded and the tablets of the covenant; but up above it were the glorious cherubs overshadowing the propitiatory [cover]." is very clear, on the cherubs being on the top of the Ark.
Considering the fact that you called this "elite-core information" I gather it is the best that the Seventh Day Adventists have on this point. If that is indeed the case, then the point is certainly decided, the side mounted cherubs is an error. Those who claimed to have seen such an Ark, clearly are lying since such an Ark is not the Biblical Ark.
I was able to open the first attachment, if any of the other attachments had better arguments on the cherubs position on the Ark, let me know. I would be will to consider them, but since the Biblical wording is so clear, I can see no way of resolving the contradiction without reaching the obvious conclusion Ron Wyatt and Ellen Harmon/White made up what they claimed to have seen.
Of course both are also exposed as lying on many other points where their stories contradict both the Bible and known facts.
Sincerely Yours; Wm Scott Anderson
P.S. I never could get your link to work that was in one of your e-mails.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 274 by Lysimachus, posted 05-09-2005 11:28 PM Lysimachus has not replied

AdminJar
Inactive Member


Message 307 of 307 (207209)
05-11-2005 5:27 PM


Finally!!!!!
Way past the Witching Hour and time to put this puppy to bed.

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