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Author Topic:   Don't turn my God-fearing kid gay!
dsv
Member (Idle past 4746 days)
Posts: 220
From: Secret Underground Hideout
Joined: 08-17-2004


Message 91 of 196 (201931)
04-24-2005 8:16 PM
Reply to: Message 90 by joshua221
04-24-2005 7:40 PM


Seeming social acceptance forces the child to believe it is truth.
God forbid we teach our children acceptance and tolerance.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 90 by joshua221, posted 04-24-2005 7:40 PM joshua221 has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 92 by Phat, posted 04-25-2005 6:35 AM dsv has replied
 Message 101 by joshua221, posted 04-25-2005 5:22 PM dsv has not replied

  
Phat
Member
Posts: 18310
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 92 of 196 (202084)
04-25-2005 6:35 AM
Reply to: Message 91 by dsv
04-24-2005 8:16 PM


DSV writes:
God forbid we teach our children acceptance and tolerance.
We need to teach acceptance and tolerance to a point. Lets say, for example, that there were certain people in society who believed that nudity was beautiful and that it was a public right to dress or not dress as one wished to do. They may claim that it was an inborn trait of theirs to shun clothes. They may say that I did not have to look at them but that I had to accept them. OK? So say that I did. What about my kids? Who decides what my kids need to be taught by others? Who decides what my kids need to accept and/or tolerate?
Do my kids need to accept everything? Do my kids need to tolerate everything? What is acceptable for the public and what is acceptable for the home? Is there a standard?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 91 by dsv, posted 04-24-2005 8:16 PM dsv has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 93 by CK, posted 04-25-2005 6:51 AM Phat has replied
 Message 95 by contracycle, posted 04-25-2005 8:37 AM Phat has not replied
 Message 96 by dsv, posted 04-25-2005 9:16 AM Phat has not replied

  
CK
Member (Idle past 4149 days)
Posts: 3221
Joined: 07-04-2004


Message 93 of 196 (202090)
04-25-2005 6:51 AM
Reply to: Message 92 by Phat
04-25-2005 6:35 AM


So what if they are nude? What are they teaching your children? that the human body exists and to show it isn't a shameful thing?
How can it be wrong to exist?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 92 by Phat, posted 04-25-2005 6:35 AM Phat has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 94 by Phat, posted 04-25-2005 6:55 AM CK has not replied

  
Phat
Member
Posts: 18310
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 94 of 196 (202092)
04-25-2005 6:55 AM
Reply to: Message 93 by CK
04-25-2005 6:51 AM


How can it be wrong to exist?
The issue is should there be a standard concerning co-existance?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 93 by CK, posted 04-25-2005 6:51 AM CK has not replied

  
contracycle
Inactive Member


Message 95 of 196 (202129)
04-25-2005 8:37 AM
Reply to: Message 92 by Phat
04-25-2005 6:35 AM


quote:
Do my kids need to accept everything? Do my kids need to tolerate everything? What is acceptable for the public and what is acceptable for the home? Is there a standard?
Well the irony is, you never do have control. Kids invariably learn to swear even if their parents never use swear-words in front of them, for example. The idea of the family home as a source of values is a bit mistaken; it is a major source, and so is the rest of society, which will certainly leak down to them despite your efforts.
This is why such public policy is a matter of public debate. And I certainly am more in favour of teaching acceptance than intolerance.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 92 by Phat, posted 04-25-2005 6:35 AM Phat has not replied

  
dsv
Member (Idle past 4746 days)
Posts: 220
From: Secret Underground Hideout
Joined: 08-17-2004


Message 96 of 196 (202148)
04-25-2005 9:16 AM
Reply to: Message 92 by Phat
04-25-2005 6:35 AM


What if? There are people that feel this way. They live in nudist colonies across the United States and the world. Since clothing is a part of our society they save their nudity for inside the land they own. They have the right to do whatever they see fit (under the law) in the privacy of their own estates.
They even have children and raise them in such areas. I remember a couple years ago some group was saying they shouldn't be allowed to raise children in that environment and it was ruled perfectly constitutional and dismissed.
Under your logic we should be asking every potential parent if they're nudists as well as homosexual?
At the very least don't homosexual couples have the same right as nudists, S&Mers, couples that role play, couples that dress up, etc. etc.?
As far as public display, there is no ban against kissing or holding hands as far as I know, just because two men or two women kissing freaks someone out doesn't make it unlawful.
Phatboy writes:
We need to teach acceptance and tolerance to a point.
It's all too common that people use religion as a free pass for bigotry, hate and intolerance. What year is it? When will we be beyond such nonsense, if ever?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 92 by Phat, posted 04-25-2005 6:35 AM Phat has not replied

  
nator
Member (Idle past 2191 days)
Posts: 12961
From: Ann Arbor
Joined: 12-09-2001


Message 97 of 196 (202176)
04-25-2005 10:34 AM
Reply to: Message 90 by joshua221
04-24-2005 7:40 PM


How? Are you saying that if your parents had been gay, you would be, too? How come that isn't true for anyone else? If what you say is true why aren't the children of homosexuals any more likely to be gay than anybody else's children?
quote:
Seeming social acceptance forces the child to believe it is truth.
That what is "truth"?
That gay people are normal?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 90 by joshua221, posted 04-24-2005 7:40 PM joshua221 has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 102 by joshua221, posted 04-25-2005 5:24 PM nator has replied

  
coffee_addict
Member (Idle past 499 days)
Posts: 3645
From: Indianapolis, IN
Joined: 03-29-2004


Message 98 of 196 (202190)
04-25-2005 12:14 PM
Reply to: Message 89 by Phat
04-24-2005 3:20 PM


Re: Don't turn my gay fearing kid liberal!
Remember when you said "it is assumed" that the public don't want people to be open about their sexuality? Well, I don't see any legislation banning Pink Floyd from writing songs like that.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 89 by Phat, posted 04-24-2005 3:20 PM Phat has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 99 by Phat, posted 04-25-2005 1:06 PM coffee_addict has replied

  
Phat
Member
Posts: 18310
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 99 of 196 (202216)
04-25-2005 1:06 PM
Reply to: Message 98 by coffee_addict
04-25-2005 12:14 PM


Re: Don't turn my gay fearing kid liberal!
That song is kinda corny yet cool, I guess. But what is your point?
This message has been edited by Phatboy, 04-25-2005 10:09 AM

This message is a reply to:
 Message 98 by coffee_addict, posted 04-25-2005 12:14 PM coffee_addict has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 100 by coffee_addict, posted 04-25-2005 1:43 PM Phat has not replied

  
coffee_addict
Member (Idle past 499 days)
Posts: 3645
From: Indianapolis, IN
Joined: 03-29-2004


Message 100 of 196 (202224)
04-25-2005 1:43 PM
Reply to: Message 99 by Phat
04-25-2005 1:06 PM


Re: Don't turn my gay fearing kid liberal!
But they were making it known that they liked girls. So, shouldn't it be the case that such a song should be outlawed? You said it yourself.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 99 by Phat, posted 04-25-2005 1:06 PM Phat has not replied

  
joshua221 
Inactive Member


Message 101 of 196 (202324)
04-25-2005 5:22 PM
Reply to: Message 91 by dsv
04-24-2005 8:16 PM


Misunderstood?

porteus@gmail.com

This message is a reply to:
 Message 91 by dsv, posted 04-24-2005 8:16 PM dsv has not replied

  
joshua221 
Inactive Member


Message 102 of 196 (202325)
04-25-2005 5:24 PM
Reply to: Message 97 by nator
04-25-2005 10:34 AM


quote:
That what is "truth"?
That gay people are normal?
Portraying homosexuality as the norm is an illusion that a child may have to be faced with if dealing with 2 gay parents. Not to say that this is necessarily bad for the child. But any fallacy should be overcome.

porteus@gmail.com

This message is a reply to:
 Message 97 by nator, posted 04-25-2005 10:34 AM nator has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 103 by jar, posted 04-25-2005 5:56 PM joshua221 has replied
 Message 106 by nator, posted 04-25-2005 9:46 PM joshua221 has replied

  
jar
Member (Idle past 416 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 103 of 196 (202339)
04-25-2005 5:56 PM
Reply to: Message 102 by joshua221
04-25-2005 5:24 PM


Let me ask you a question.
Is it better for a child to grow up thinking loving parents are the norm or that abusive parents are the norm?

Aslan is not a Tame Lion

This message is a reply to:
 Message 102 by joshua221, posted 04-25-2005 5:24 PM joshua221 has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 104 by joshua221, posted 04-25-2005 7:41 PM jar has replied

  
joshua221 
Inactive Member


Message 104 of 196 (202384)
04-25-2005 7:41 PM
Reply to: Message 103 by jar
04-25-2005 5:56 PM


quote:
Is it better for a child to grow up thinking loving parents are the norm or that abusive parents are the norm?
Blatantly stated that there wasn't anything necessarily wrong with gay parents. Although it does provide an illusion of what is acceptable in society. It means nearly nothing, the world is nothing.

porteus@gmail.com

This message is a reply to:
 Message 103 by jar, posted 04-25-2005 5:56 PM jar has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 105 by jar, posted 04-25-2005 8:08 PM joshua221 has replied
 Message 107 by dsv, posted 04-26-2005 12:17 PM joshua221 has replied

  
jar
Member (Idle past 416 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 105 of 196 (202392)
04-25-2005 8:08 PM
Reply to: Message 104 by joshua221
04-25-2005 7:41 PM


So let's work first to get as many loving parents as we can for the kids.

Aslan is not a Tame Lion

This message is a reply to:
 Message 104 by joshua221, posted 04-25-2005 7:41 PM joshua221 has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 108 by joshua221, posted 04-27-2005 5:59 PM jar has replied

  
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