If push came to angonising torture.......

Would I be a martyr? Not right away. I would keep quiet and to myself, pretending to have no hint of spirituality. I would go about so robotic that people would notice a change in me from my old self before the new regime took over. I would pray in private and trust that God had a plan in the midst of this quest for human deification!

I did'nt, anyway.
I came into the world knowing about God. This brings up an interesting point...namely, is belief a product of culture? I would, of course assert that NO, I know that God is apart from culture.
If I had no Bible, I never would have known this fact to be verifiable(culturally reinforced.)
I would never have had a culturally acceptable venue within which to "get saved" since there never would have been a church.There would be no peer reinforcement and in all likelilhood no underground movement as we would now envision such an activity. I suppose that I would not go around acting robotic....
you are correct that emotions exist as a normal thing. You are asking me to imagine such a world from my current state of mind, however. To you, my state of mind (belief) is a product of cultural indoctorination. While I know in my heart that God exists apart from all of this, it WOULD indeed be a unique world in which you speak. God would reach people in a way that you have not described in your scenario. The reason? You have defined the parameters of this world, and God supercedes your parameters for all practical purposes. In my Belief, anyhow.

Hi, Custard. In the world according to Phatboy, God imagined man before man imagined God. I agree with you that it is often rude and presumptious for anyone to preach to you simply for the sake of intellectual smugness, naive misguided zeal, or fullfillment of cult quotas! When I step over the line to share my faith, it is in the interests of the spirit of discussion.I am under no illusion that I will or ever even could convert anyone!
I desire conversation...ideally in a spirit of agreeable communion (ala Bryan and Jar) but it is within my admittedly absolutist and somewhat fundamentalist belief paradigm (in other words, in the Bible)
that we are in the midst of a spiritual war.As I declare this to you, I realize how absurd that it sounds.
Quite properly, I am sounding too much like a religious fundamentalist zealot!In reflection, if I truly do want to share a communion with atheists,
I will need to pray more and talk less. God surely loves Atheists
(even stubborn ones like Rrhain!) and I would do well to pray to God more and try and BE God less.

You are such a loveable Texan! I had a vision of the scripture references to the Bride...the church...the called out ones...meeting Jesus.I also remember where you talk of actions speaking louder than words.Finally, I saw how the atheists in this post respect their friends enough to attend church, and I saw in a moment how God uses your gentle Texas love to bring them there.It makes me no less passionate about my beliefs, but it humbles me.
I now begin to see why you abhor fundamentalism.Fundamentalist (religious Right types) claim to be speaking for God, but when people see them spouting rhetoric it appears less like God and more like Godzilla!This message has been edited by Phatboy, 02-24-2005 08:47 AM