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Author Topic:   Is Faith Harmless?
jar
Member (Idle past 425 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 7 of 20 (153929)
10-28-2004 10:50 PM
Reply to: Message 1 by MrHambre
10-28-2004 7:12 PM


I think you may be making a mistake.
I think the issue may be more closely related to fundamentalism and fanticism than faith. History is resplendent with examples of horrific acts committed by both the religious and non-religious.
IMHO, the problem is one of extreme behaviour of an exclusionary nature, regardless of origin.
The mindset of faith, especially faith in invisible deities and rewards in the afterlife, is not conducive to critical thinking or responsible discourse.
I think you would have a hard time supporting such an assertion. While there might well be differences between two people who discuss faith or religion, I don't think you can arbitrarily say that those with faith are less able to think critically than those without.
I assert that a person's faith is indeed relevant to his ability or willingness to treat people with tolerance and goodwill, and certainly affects the importance he places on empirical evidence.
Well, that can certainly be read both ways. I, for one, would agree that those with faith would be more likely "to treat people with tolerance and goodwill". The issue is that there can be bigots across the spectrum, believers and non-believers. On the bell curve, those that fall in the extremes regardless of faith are more likely to show less tolerance than the vast majority.

Aslan is not a Tame Lion

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by MrHambre, posted 10-28-2004 7:12 PM MrHambre has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 8 by Gilgamesh, posted 10-29-2004 12:36 AM jar has replied
 Message 13 by Mammuthus, posted 10-29-2004 3:59 AM jar has replied

  
jar
Member (Idle past 425 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 9 of 20 (153995)
10-29-2004 12:53 AM
Reply to: Message 8 by Gilgamesh
10-29-2004 12:36 AM


I have a feeling you've never hung around any Jesuits.
Within the realms of their faith, there is little to no critical thinking or responsible discourse.
I guess I've found that not to be the case. While there are obvious nut cases, frauds and frankly, hooligans among the faith based community, there are also quite a few who do try to hold responsible discourse.
And this can involve critically important social apsects of their lives, like politics and science, so depending upon the nature of their faith, they may be valueless contributors to society.
Sure, but is that limited to only those you would class as faith based? There have been many examples of people holding fanatical beliefs and acting on them that were not faith based.
I certainly agree that it is important for folk, particularly those in power and influence to be able to think critically and to descriminate, but that is for another thread (see thread on whether a Creationist should hold a postition of power).

Aslan is not a Tame Lion

This message is a reply to:
 Message 8 by Gilgamesh, posted 10-29-2004 12:36 AM Gilgamesh has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 10 by Gilgamesh, posted 10-29-2004 1:12 AM jar has not replied

  
jar
Member (Idle past 425 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 14 of 20 (154042)
10-29-2004 6:01 AM
Reply to: Message 13 by Mammuthus
10-29-2004 3:59 AM


Re: I think you may be making a mistake.
I believe that if you look at the paragraph as a whole, you'll find I did not disagree with your position.
Well, that can certainly be read both ways. I, for one, would agree that those with faith would be more likely "to treat people with tolerance and goodwill". The issue is that there can be bigots across the spectrum, believers and non-believers. On the bell curve, those that fall in the extremes regardless of faith are more likely to show less tolerance than the vast majority.
As I said, there will be those that are bigots whether they are believers or non-believers. There is also the issue that particularly within the Christian Community, those members lying on the extreme limits are also among the most vocal. I would agree that many, particularly literalist, Christians are bigots.

Aslan is not a Tame Lion

This message is a reply to:
 Message 13 by Mammuthus, posted 10-29-2004 3:59 AM Mammuthus has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 15 by Mammuthus, posted 10-29-2004 6:45 AM jar has not replied

  
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