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Author Topic:   Computer help?
ohnhai
Member (Idle past 5161 days)
Posts: 649
From: Melbourne, Australia
Joined: 11-17-2004


Message 136 of 297 (351696)
09-23-2006 10:32 PM
Reply to: Message 133 by Taz
09-23-2006 9:01 PM


Re: Don't you wish you had a Mac?
gasby writes:
The only thing mac is good for is being a paperweight
But they do make some AWESOME LCD monitors... Not as cool as my new WACOM Cintiq21UX, but nice all the same.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 133 by Taz, posted 09-23-2006 9:01 PM Taz has not replied

Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1444 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 137 of 297 (351718)
09-24-2006 1:29 AM
Reply to: Message 135 by ohnhai
09-23-2006 10:29 PM


Re: The best cheap deal
You are pretty much echoing the main advice I've received on this thread that I'm going to follow.
What "second machine listed above" are you talking about? The second of the two Iano listed?
Yes, I'm pretty computer illiterate. I knew Celeron was Pentium 2 but what exactly that means, no. Power, speed, something, of the "processor" which I gather is a bunch of circuits in the CPU, separate from the hard drive. I figure I want more power, speed, within budget. More RAM for sure. Is it RAM you mean when you say "Also make sure you get at least 1gig of memory?"
What is 510 RAM or 1024 RAM?
Is this the system you are talking about?
From Message 92
Components:
AMD Athlon™ 64 3200+
Genuine Windows® XP Home Edition with re-installation CD
512MB Single Channel DDR2 SDRAM at 533MHz - 1DIMM
80GB Serial ATA Hard Drive (7200RPM) w/DataBurst Cache™
48X CD-RW/ DVD Combo Drive
17 inch E177FP Analog Flat Panel
NVIDIA GeForce 6150 LE Integrated Graphics GPU
Integrated 7.1 Channel Audio
Accessories:
Dell A225 Speakers
Dell USB Keyboard and Dell 2-button Scroll Mouse
No Floppy Drive Included
56K PCI Data Fax Modem
Software:
No productivity suite- Includes Microsoft Works 8. DOES NOT INCLUDE MS WORD
No Security Subscription
Starter pack- Basic and trial products from Corel and Yahoo
Service
1Yr Ltd Warranty, 1Yr At-Home Service, and 1Yr HW Warranty Support
6 Months of America Online Membership Included
Also Includes
Mouse included in Wireless, Laser or Bluetooth Package
Adobe® Acrobat® Reader 7.0
Integrated 10/100 Ethernet
Award Winning Service and Support

This message is a reply to:
 Message 135 by ohnhai, posted 09-23-2006 10:29 PM ohnhai has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 138 by kuresu, posted 09-24-2006 2:11 AM Faith has replied

kuresu
Member (Idle past 2512 days)
Posts: 2544
From: boulder, colorado
Joined: 03-24-2006


Message 138 of 297 (351721)
09-24-2006 2:11 AM
Reply to: Message 137 by Faith
09-24-2006 1:29 AM


Re: The best cheap deal
I don't know if the whole "pentium" thing has been cleared up.
Let's use a shoe analogy. We have company "Birkenstock". B (for short) makes shoe "cork" and shoe "leather". Now let's move onto processors.
We have company "Intel". I (for short) makes processor "Pentium" and processor "Celeron".
Basically, just brand names.
As to what Ohnhai was talking about: "1gig of memory". He was telling you to get 1 gigabyte of RAM. 510 RAM, and 1024 RAM, are, respectively, 510 megabytes and 1024 megabytes. Keep in mind, one thousand MB (megabyte) is one GB (gigabyte). for future reference:
8 bits = 1 byte
1000 bytes = one kilobyte
1000 kilobytes = one megabyte
1000 megabytes = one gigabyte
1000 gigabytes = one terabyte
(all ='s are approximate, due to how memory is actually stored. But close enough for practical purposes)
(don't worry about bits)
As to the system--looks good, but don't remember the other one Iano posted. If you want to shave off of bit more money, do not, I repeat, do not go for the flat panel screen (they're like laptop screens). Then use the money spared by sticking with a traditional monitor to get the extra 500 MB of RAM you need.
Another area:
switching from zip to another media. Pick up a thumb drive (aka memory stick, flash drive)(the thing that crash had a picture of). My dad's computer, which he got in '99, had USB ports. Your's should too. Then its just a matter of sticking the thumb drive into your USB port (get someone at the best buy to show you what they look like and how to connect to them with your thumb drive). Stick in your zip disk, and then transfer the data onto the thumb drive.
Here's how I'd do it. Keep your old system for the moment. Get the new one. Get the thumb drive. Then, once you move the data from a couple of zips onto the thumb drive, move the data from the thumb drive onto the new computer.
Even if your current computer does not have a thumb drive, do get one. They are literally the new floppy disk (and are approaching the amount of hard drive memory my dad's computer had--4 gigabytes).
If you need something further explained, ask away.

Want to help give back to the world community? Did you know that your computer can help? Join the newest TeamEvC Climate Modelling to help improve climate predictions for a better tomorrow.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 137 by Faith, posted 09-24-2006 1:29 AM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 139 by Faith, posted 09-24-2006 4:09 AM kuresu has not replied

Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1444 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 139 of 297 (351734)
09-24-2006 4:09 AM
Reply to: Message 138 by kuresu
09-24-2006 2:11 AM


Re: The best cheap deal
Thank you, that was quite helpful. I don't know why I couldn't figure out about gigabytes. I even looked it up but the information wouldn't take. I couldn't figure that the 1024 RAM was MB and that means 1 GB, which is what Ohnai was saying to be sure to get. I think I need it the way I keep programs open all the time.
Thanks for the info about the best way to use the thumb drive. I'd pretty much decided I had to have that. I hope my computer lasts long enough to pull all this off. It's been doing amazingly well today considering how bad it's been lately.
You are right about the panel screen. I don't even like them.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 138 by kuresu, posted 09-24-2006 2:11 AM kuresu has not replied

MangyTiger
Member (Idle past 6353 days)
Posts: 989
From: Leicester, UK
Joined: 07-30-2004


Message 140 of 297 (351776)
09-24-2006 11:03 AM
Reply to: Message 134 by Faith
09-23-2006 9:02 PM


Get a copy of SP2 as well
I would guess that given the age of your XP CDs they don't include Service Pack 2 (SP2).
You really need SP2 on your machine - it is quite vunerable to attack without it. I know somebody who reinstalled Windows and in the time it took them to download SP2 from the Microsoft site and install it their PC was infected.

Oops! Wrong Planet

This message is a reply to:
 Message 134 by Faith, posted 09-23-2006 9:02 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 143 by Faith, posted 09-24-2006 6:32 PM MangyTiger has not replied

crashfrog
Member (Idle past 1466 days)
Posts: 19762
From: Silver Spring, MD
Joined: 03-20-2003


Message 141 of 297 (351849)
09-24-2006 5:48 PM
Reply to: Message 122 by AnswersInGenitals
09-23-2006 4:59 PM


Re: Don't you wish you had a Mac?
Boy, do you guys make me happy that I'm in the Mac universe!
Don't break your arm patting yourself on the back, macboy. Your machine has a BIOS, too - you just aren't allowed to access it. Which means a lot of the sweet features of the Core 2 Duo chips that ship with the new Macs, like unlocked processor clock frequencies? You can't use 'em.
Granted, though - PC chipset makers are idiots for not defaulting the BIOS to attempt to boot from CD first. Most BIOS have a boot menu function (usually F8) that serves the same purpose. Don't get me wrong, I'm no PC partisan - there's at least 3 operating systems running in my apartment at any one time - but a lot of the Mac hardware archetecture stresses usability or power consumption/heat production at the expense of performance.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 122 by AnswersInGenitals, posted 09-23-2006 4:59 PM AnswersInGenitals has not replied

crashfrog
Member (Idle past 1466 days)
Posts: 19762
From: Silver Spring, MD
Joined: 03-20-2003


Message 142 of 297 (351861)
09-24-2006 6:02 PM
Reply to: Message 135 by ohnhai
09-23-2006 10:29 PM


ATA support on new mobo's
It’s odds on that the new motherboard would also have been designed to accept only the newer SATA hard drives, meaning you would have to buy new hard drives.
Chipset makers aren't taking ATA off motherboards any time soon. As far as I know it's supported by all the current chipsets (NVIDIA nForce, ATI Crossfire, and the Intel family stuff) and will be for a while because while SATA hard drives are as cheap and profligate as ATA drives, the same is not yet true for SATA optical drives.
ATA isn't going anywhere for the time being, and we're well beyond the point where chipset makers can't spare the die space for legacy busses. Now it's true that your average new motherboard may not have the customary two ATA headers, but it'll have one for sure.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 135 by ohnhai, posted 09-23-2006 10:29 PM ohnhai has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 144 by Faith, posted 09-24-2006 6:36 PM crashfrog has replied

Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1444 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 143 of 297 (351879)
09-24-2006 6:32 PM
Reply to: Message 140 by MangyTiger
09-24-2006 11:03 AM


Re: Get a copy of SP2 as well
I would guess that given the age of your XP CDs they don't include Service Pack 2 (SP2).
You really need SP2 on your machine - it is quite vunerable to attack without it. I know somebody who reinstalled Windows and in the time it took them to download SP2 from the Microsoft site and install it their PC was infected.
You mean virus attack I suppose. I've been making do with AVG and Ad-Aware freebies I downloaded from the web. What about SP2 that comes with a new computer with Windows XP already on it? Then if I load my old CDs (I probably wouldn't have to install the Windows program on a new machine, but most likely the Office XP program) the protection will already be there. No?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 140 by MangyTiger, posted 09-24-2006 11:03 AM MangyTiger has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 145 by kuresu, posted 09-24-2006 7:13 PM Faith has not replied

Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1444 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 144 of 297 (351882)
09-24-2006 6:36 PM
Reply to: Message 142 by crashfrog
09-24-2006 6:02 PM


Re: ATA support on new mobo's
What if I like the sound of a computer that has a SATA hard drive? What is the problem again for my purposes?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 142 by crashfrog, posted 09-24-2006 6:02 PM crashfrog has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 146 by crashfrog, posted 09-24-2006 10:29 PM Faith has replied

kuresu
Member (Idle past 2512 days)
Posts: 2544
From: boulder, colorado
Joined: 03-24-2006


Message 145 of 297 (351891)
09-24-2006 7:13 PM
Reply to: Message 143 by Faith
09-24-2006 6:32 PM


Re: Get a copy of SP2 as well
assuming microsoft has a brain, the SP2 should be on any new computer you buy (especially from a store, where you aren't installing the OS).
I just recently got a new computer--couple of months ago, but I can't remember if I had to download SP2 from the net.
(and since this thread is about computer help: I've got a dual-core processor. How do i turn the other one on, and how do I use it?)

Want to help give back to the world community? Did you know that your computer can help? Join the newest TeamEvC Climate Modelling to help improve climate predictions for a better tomorrow.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 143 by Faith, posted 09-24-2006 6:32 PM Faith has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 148 by crashfrog, posted 09-24-2006 10:43 PM kuresu has not replied

crashfrog
Member (Idle past 1466 days)
Posts: 19762
From: Silver Spring, MD
Joined: 03-20-2003


Message 146 of 297 (351925)
09-24-2006 10:29 PM
Reply to: Message 144 by Faith
09-24-2006 6:36 PM


Re: ATA support on new mobo's
What if I like the sound of a computer that has a SATA hard drive? What is the problem again for my purposes?
For your purposes? No problem that I can see.
I understand you to be saying here that you're interested in a new computer with a SATA hard drive. Yes? I don't see you having any problems there - just about all the systems a Best Buy (for instance) will sell will have a SATA hard drive.
If you're looking at a SATA hard drive for your current system, from what you've described I'd say there's about an 80% chance that you don't have SATA support. So if you're shopping for a new hard drive for an old system, go with regular ATA (they sometimes call it "PATA" now, it can be confusing). SATA drives won't work for you, probably. But there's no reason not to look for SATA support in a new system that I can think of. You won't notice a difference in the day-to-day operation of your computer except that loading programs and files should be faster. I'm going with SATA for all my new drives.
To sum up:
1) New computer? No reason not to look for a computer with a SATA hard drive, and they shouldn't be hard to find.
2) New drive in an old computer? Stick with ATA (aka "PATA") drives.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 144 by Faith, posted 09-24-2006 6:36 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 147 by Faith, posted 09-24-2006 10:33 PM crashfrog has replied

Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1444 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 147 of 297 (351926)
09-24-2006 10:33 PM
Reply to: Message 146 by crashfrog
09-24-2006 10:29 PM


Re: ATA support on new mobo's
I get it, thanks. Yes, I think the best solution is to get a new system, and SATA is everywhere. I still don't get what it is, I just want to be sure it's OK to get.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 146 by crashfrog, posted 09-24-2006 10:29 PM crashfrog has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 149 by crashfrog, posted 09-24-2006 11:47 PM Faith has replied

crashfrog
Member (Idle past 1466 days)
Posts: 19762
From: Silver Spring, MD
Joined: 03-20-2003


Message 148 of 297 (351930)
09-24-2006 10:43 PM
Reply to: Message 145 by kuresu
09-24-2006 7:13 PM


Re: Get a copy of SP2 as well
(and since this thread is about computer help: I've got a dual-core processor. How do i turn the other one on, and how do I use it?)
It should already be on. Right-click on "My Computer", select "Properties", and right there under "General" it should say something like "Pentium D CPU 2.60 gHz (2)" or something to indicate it's detecting 2 CPU's. (If you have one of the Extreme Edition Pentiums that support both dual-core and hyperthreading, it has two physical cores, each with two virtual cores, and it'll show up as four CPUs.)
If you don't see 2 CPUs, you may need to activate dual-core support in your BIOS. I can't tell you how to do that. If you have both cores detected in Windows, the OS should already be passing off jobs to the second core. But you won't see much of a performance gain in any program that isn't already written to take advantage of an extra core.
If you really want to put your system to the test you need some kind of benchmarking software.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 145 by kuresu, posted 09-24-2006 7:13 PM kuresu has not replied

crashfrog
Member (Idle past 1466 days)
Posts: 19762
From: Silver Spring, MD
Joined: 03-20-2003


Message 149 of 297 (351939)
09-24-2006 11:47 PM
Reply to: Message 147 by Faith
09-24-2006 10:33 PM


SATA vs. ATA - not that important
I still don't get what it is, I just want to be sure it's OK to get.
ATA: Older, slower, not user-friendly. Have to turn off the computer to plug and unplug them. Can't use it outside of the computer. Used for hard drives in basically every PC for the past decade and a half. Drives have to be configured and "addressed" using tiny plastic tabs called "jumpers". (Jumpering drives is deep nerd-fu which is why you've never had to do it.)
SATA ("Serial ATA"): Newer, faster. Can plug and unplug the drives while the computer is on ("hotswapping"). Can be used for both internal and external drives. (Oddly, though, SATA for external drives hasn't really caught on yet.) No need to jumper drives or basically do anything except plug them into a SATA port.
Honestly we're already made a much bigger deal about it than is necessary. It's just that right now, currently, the PC world is in the middle of a shift from ATA to SATA hardware. It's during those times, when standards change and new technology emerges, you can be caught up in "gotchas" where your replacement part doesn't actually work with your old system. Honestly whether or not you have SATA drives is pretty low on your priorities when you go computer shopping.
The most important things to consider are:
1) CPU type and speed. Just have the clerk show you the fastest CPUs in your price range. Have an idea of how much you want to spend and they can work within that budget.
2) Amount of RAM. One gig - 1024 MB - is the perfect amount. More will cost you without you seeing an immediate benefit, and less will be almost immediately obsolete.
3) Optical drives. (CD-ROMS, etc.) Recording DVD's is a must. Even if you don't have a DVD player or think you have any need to burn a DVD, you'll eventually want to, and it's a ridiculously cheap way to get a bunch of data off a computer. One 4.7 gig DVD is as much storage space as almost 50 of your ZIP disks. Cheap DVD's you can only burn once are pennies apiece. DVD's for use in special DVD-Rewritable drives aren't much more expensive.
4) Stuff like graphics cards, big flat panel monitors, aren't that important for you I suspect. Even if you were a gamer like me you'd be immediately replacing whatever underpowered graphics card it came with something much more beefy. So whatever the clerk tells you about the graphics you can basically ignore. It's not a factor in your decision. Whether or not you want a new monitor is up to you. The amount of desk space you can save with a flat-panel screen is just amazing, and they're a lot cheaper than they used to be. Easier on the eyes, too, in my opinion. They flicker and whine less. (Am I the only one who can hear when any kind of ray-tube screen is on in the vicinity?)
Honestly, your goal should be to go in with a set amount you're ready to spend, and walk out of there with a machine that's more suited to home office use, with a big hard drive and DVD-RW's for data storage, than a high-powered system with powerful graphics support for multimedia farting around and video games. That's how I see it. Let the clerk steer you towards whatever systems he feels are best for those needs within your budget, and then just get whatever system you like best. Shouldn't be a big stressful thing. (I love buying computers and parts.)

This message is a reply to:
 Message 147 by Faith, posted 09-24-2006 10:33 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 150 by Faith, posted 09-25-2006 12:17 AM crashfrog has not replied

Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1444 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 150 of 297 (351954)
09-25-2006 12:17 AM
Reply to: Message 149 by crashfrog
09-24-2006 11:47 PM


thumb drive question
Thank you. Lots to munch on there.
One more question.
If I can't get this right away and have to nurse this old machine along for a while (or if it crashes I can borrow a functional computer a friend is willing to lend me for a while), I should probably get that thumb drive thing NOW and start backing up my stuff to that instead of these Zip disks before the system completely goes. Right?
In that case I need to find out if I have the right port in this computer for the thumb drive. I'm not sure what it looks like. And although I could probably find out online I'm avoiding going anywhere on the web except Google and EvC because it pretty predictably causes a freezeup.
Would you -- or somebody -- please describe it or put up a picture?
Thanks.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 149 by crashfrog, posted 09-24-2006 11:47 PM crashfrog has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 151 by NosyNed, posted 09-25-2006 12:34 AM Faith has replied
 Message 153 by kuresu, posted 09-25-2006 1:11 AM Faith has replied
 Message 154 by AnswersInGenitals, posted 09-25-2006 1:12 AM Faith has replied
 Message 156 by DrJones*, posted 09-25-2006 1:16 AM Faith has not replied

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