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Author Topic:   Let The Debates Begin! Obama v Romney
onifre
Member (Idle past 2951 days)
Posts: 4854
From: Dark Side of the Moon
Joined: 02-20-2008


(2)
Message 16 of 86 (674885)
10-03-2012 11:33 PM
Reply to: Message 6 by Phat
10-03-2012 10:29 AM


Re: Which Platform Has More Substance?
Free Market versus Socialism?
Socialism and the free market work just fine together, those aren't the options.
This country has too many stupids and fearful retards to even consider a working system of socialism. Don't know why people keep mentioning it other than as a fear tactic.
The problem is not free market vs socialism, it's to remove the public sector from....
Oh who gives a shit.
- Oni

This message is a reply to:
 Message 6 by Phat, posted 10-03-2012 10:29 AM Phat has seen this message but not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 26 by dronestar, posted 10-04-2012 10:50 AM onifre has replied

  
Taz
Member (Idle past 3291 days)
Posts: 5069
From: Zerus
Joined: 07-18-2006


Message 17 of 86 (674893)
10-04-2012 1:09 AM
Reply to: Message 15 by Phat
10-03-2012 3:45 PM


Re: Which Platform Has More Substance?
Phat writes:
Obamacare has cost my union health insurance more in that they now have to insure a wider pool of people than they did before...
Hang on a sec. I thought you were a christian. By the very definition of that word, you follow christ's word, right?
Blah, why do I even bother....?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 15 by Phat, posted 10-03-2012 3:45 PM Phat has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 18 by Dr Adequate, posted 10-04-2012 1:41 AM Taz has not replied
 Message 59 by Phat, posted 10-09-2012 7:28 AM Taz has not replied

  
Dr Adequate
Member (Idle past 284 days)
Posts: 16113
Joined: 07-20-2006


Message 18 of 86 (674895)
10-04-2012 1:41 AM
Reply to: Message 17 by Taz
10-04-2012 1:09 AM


Re: Which Platform Has More Substance?
If what Phat says is true, I don't see why it would be unchristian to say it.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 17 by Taz, posted 10-04-2012 1:09 AM Taz has not replied

  
Straggler
Member
Posts: 10333
From: London England
Joined: 09-30-2006


Message 19 of 86 (674915)
10-04-2012 7:38 AM


So did anyone see the debate....?
Wasn't it on yesterday/last night?
What happened?
The impression I get is that US presidential debates are highly choreographed and stage managed affairs rather than genuine full-on debates and that it is more a question of whether anyone will make some sort of blunder or gaffe that can be analysed to death by the news networks.
Given the lack of hysterical coverage here I am assuming that no blunders or gaffes occurred.

Replies to this message:
 Message 20 by NoNukes, posted 10-04-2012 8:40 AM Straggler has not replied
 Message 21 by crashfrog, posted 10-04-2012 8:41 AM Straggler has not replied

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


Message 20 of 86 (674917)
10-04-2012 8:40 AM
Reply to: Message 19 by Straggler
10-04-2012 7:38 AM


Re: So did anyone see the debate....?
I watched the debates. Obama appeared to get his head handed to him on style points. Obama knew inside and out what Romney's plans were and where they would lead the country, but Obama seemed taken aback when Romney simply lied and denied. Romney's plan was untenable, but Obama seemed clueless on how to communicate this to the audience without tutoring them like a law professor.
Romney did an excellent job of calling out Obama for choices like investing 90 billion dollars worth of investments in green energy, while defending tax breaks for oil companies.
Romney seemed likeable, while Obama appeared irritated and to simply to want to be somewhere else.
In my opinion, Obama missed a huge chance to end this election on the spot. Now the future debates, and even the vice presidential debates matter. I would expect that the Republican base was fully energized. This was the best I've ever seen Romney look, ever.

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
The apathy of the people is enough to make every statue leap from its pedestal and hasten the resurrection of the dead. William Lloyd Garrison.
It's not too late to register to vote. State Registration Deadlines

This message is a reply to:
 Message 19 by Straggler, posted 10-04-2012 7:38 AM Straggler has not replied

Replies to this message:
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crashfrog
Member (Idle past 1467 days)
Posts: 19762
From: Silver Spring, MD
Joined: 03-20-2003


(1)
Message 21 of 86 (674919)
10-04-2012 8:41 AM
Reply to: Message 19 by Straggler
10-04-2012 7:38 AM


Re: So did anyone see the debate....?
It was just kind of boring, really; Obama passed on a lot of what were seen as opportunities to attack Romney, but didn't really give Romney much of a chance to use any of his prepared "zingers." Jim Leher couldn't keep control of the proceedings, with the result that Romney basically walked off with the show.
The general consensus is that this is a "win" for Romney, but with Obama has such a tremendous lead that unless Romney changed the game, he lost. And despite what people are thinking is a tepid performance, Obama denied Romney the game-changer. So nothing happened. Boring.
Probably the highlight of the night was the CNN "fact-check" that basically said that if you take Romney at his word, his claims are true.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 19 by Straggler, posted 10-04-2012 7:38 AM Straggler has not replied

  
crashfrog
Member (Idle past 1467 days)
Posts: 19762
From: Silver Spring, MD
Joined: 03-20-2003


Message 22 of 86 (674920)
10-04-2012 8:54 AM
Reply to: Message 20 by NoNukes
10-04-2012 8:40 AM


Re: So did anyone see the debate....?
In my opinion, Obama missed a huge chance to end this election on the spot.
What? That makes no sense. It's not like Romney can drop out of the election, there's no "end" except voting in November. And Obama already had a lead so large that it's going to take a major event to upset the inevitable Obama victory.
And Romney didn't get it. The election is exactly as "over" as it possibly could be. What didn't Obama do? Make the obvious attacks that the Romney team was prepared for? Did you hear Romney's line of attack on how Romneycare wasn't exactly like the ACA? It was rehearsed and potentially devastatingly effective - it's possible that the Obama team won't be able to equate them anymore. Do you really believe they didn't have something like that on "47%"? On "Etch-a-Sketch"? On Bain Capital? The smartest thing Obama did all night was avoid those lines of attack, neutralizing Romney's chance to respond to them.
People wanted to see blood, but they seem to have forgotten that Obama wins in the long game, because he lets his opponents knock themselves out. Obama's not the guy who ends the election in a single stroke because he knows elections don't ever work like that. They go until the vote.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 20 by NoNukes, posted 10-04-2012 8:40 AM NoNukes has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 23 by NoNukes, posted 10-04-2012 9:13 AM crashfrog has replied

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


Message 23 of 86 (674922)
10-04-2012 9:13 AM
Reply to: Message 22 by crashfrog
10-04-2012 8:54 AM


Re: So did anyone see the debate....?
What? That makes no sense. It's not like Romney can drop out of the election, there's no "end" except voting in November.
Of course the election is in November. But that is scarcely a month away. That huge lead you talk about really consists of 5-6 points in a handful of states. Overcoming that is doable.
In my opinion, Obama could have closed out the race last night. I expect turnout for the upcoming election to be poor, and if Romney had gotten anything but a huge win in the debate last night, I think we could have counted on a de-energized base for Romney. Instead I think we have the opposite.
Let's see if there is a significant closing of the gap over the next weeks worth of polling. In my opinion, Obama frittered away a good portion of his lead last night.
I'm still optimistic about the final result, but Romney clearly did himself a lot of good last night.

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
The apathy of the people is enough to make every statue leap from its pedestal and hasten the resurrection of the dead. William Lloyd Garrison.
It's not too late to register to vote. State Registration Deadlines

This message is a reply to:
 Message 22 by crashfrog, posted 10-04-2012 8:54 AM crashfrog has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 24 by crashfrog, posted 10-04-2012 9:40 AM NoNukes has replied

  
crashfrog
Member (Idle past 1467 days)
Posts: 19762
From: Silver Spring, MD
Joined: 03-20-2003


Message 24 of 86 (674926)
10-04-2012 9:40 AM
Reply to: Message 23 by NoNukes
10-04-2012 9:13 AM


Re: So did anyone see the debate....?
That huge lead you talk about really consists of 5-6 points in a handful of states. Overcoming that is doable.
But every day Romney doesn't overcome it, it becomes harder and harder to.
In my opinion, Obama could have closed out the race last night.
How, specifically? Making the attacks that Romney had spent weeks prepping for? You heard him on Romneycare, right? Don't you think he had a million of those? And how is the election not every bit as "closed out" as it could possibly be?
Instead I think we have the opposite.
Let's see it last through two more debates. Obama plays the long game, remember?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 23 by NoNukes, posted 10-04-2012 9:13 AM NoNukes has replied

Replies to this message:
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 Message 40 by NoNukes, posted 10-04-2012 12:26 PM crashfrog has replied

  
Straggler
Member
Posts: 10333
From: London England
Joined: 09-30-2006


Message 25 of 86 (674928)
10-04-2012 10:46 AM
Reply to: Message 24 by crashfrog
10-04-2012 9:40 AM


Re: So did anyone see the debate....?
Have polls in the US ever been significantly wrong regarding an eventual actual presidential result?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 24 by crashfrog, posted 10-04-2012 9:40 AM crashfrog has not replied

Replies to this message:
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 Message 28 by Coyote, posted 10-04-2012 10:58 AM Straggler has replied
 Message 30 by onifre, posted 10-04-2012 11:12 AM Straggler has replied

  
dronestar
Member
Posts: 1407
From: usa
Joined: 11-19-2008


Message 26 of 86 (674929)
10-04-2012 10:50 AM
Reply to: Message 16 by onifre
10-03-2012 11:33 PM


Re: Which Platform Has More Substance?
Oni writes:
Oh who gives a shit?
It's tiresome, ain't it?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 16 by onifre, posted 10-03-2012 11:33 PM onifre has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 31 by onifre, posted 10-04-2012 11:14 AM dronestar has replied

  
jar
Member (Idle past 394 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 27 of 86 (674931)
10-04-2012 10:58 AM
Reply to: Message 25 by Straggler
10-04-2012 10:46 AM


Re: So did anyone see the debate....?
Absolutely.
Dewey Defeats Truman!

Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 25 by Straggler, posted 10-04-2012 10:46 AM Straggler has not replied

Replies to this message:
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Coyote
Member (Idle past 2106 days)
Posts: 6117
Joined: 01-12-2008


Message 28 of 86 (674932)
10-04-2012 10:58 AM
Reply to: Message 25 by Straggler
10-04-2012 10:46 AM


Re: So did anyone see the debate....?
Have polls in the US ever been significantly wrong regarding an eventual actual presidential result?
In 1980 Carter was leading Reagan by a significant amount at this point.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 25 by Straggler, posted 10-04-2012 10:46 AM Straggler has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 29 by Straggler, posted 10-04-2012 11:02 AM Coyote has replied

  
Straggler
Member
Posts: 10333
From: London England
Joined: 09-30-2006


Message 29 of 86 (674933)
10-04-2012 11:02 AM
Reply to: Message 28 by Coyote
10-04-2012 10:58 AM


Re: So did anyone see the debate....?
As our resident right-winger what did you make of the debate? Did you see it? Is Romney the man for you?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 28 by Coyote, posted 10-04-2012 10:58 AM Coyote has replied

Replies to this message:
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onifre
Member (Idle past 2951 days)
Posts: 4854
From: Dark Side of the Moon
Joined: 02-20-2008


Message 30 of 86 (674934)
10-04-2012 11:12 AM
Reply to: Message 25 by Straggler
10-04-2012 10:46 AM


Re: So did anyone see the debate....?
Have polls in the US ever been significantly wrong regarding an eventual actual presidential result?
The person that wins is the person who invested the most moeny in their campaign. It's all in the advertising. Follow those numbers and you'll have your winner.
- Oni

This message is a reply to:
 Message 25 by Straggler, posted 10-04-2012 10:46 AM Straggler has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 36 by Straggler, posted 10-04-2012 11:43 AM onifre has replied

  
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